[Coach_Owens87]

"More than a billion gallons of coal fly ash, a byproduct of burning coal, spilled Monday when the dike burst on a retention pond at the Kingston Fossil Plant. The spill covered 300 acres with sludge in Harriman, about 35 miles west of Knoxville. It dumped a mix of ash and water in the Emory River, causing residents of nearby Kingston to worry about their drinking water."

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/arti...wD95C387O0


What was that Old school said about the safety of all these retention ponds?

Lets hear the PR pro coal spin he has to spit out!

[Beetle01]

This is old news.

Hey if you want a cut back on coal mining coach, do us all here a favor and stop using electricity.

[Coach_Owens87]

This is old news.

Hey if you want a cut back on coal mining coach, do us all here a favor and stop using electricity.

Yeah it sure is, this all happened in the far far distant past of one week ago.

No one had mentioned the story, so I just thought I would see what people thought.

And dont worry about my electrical use, I do my part to cut back.

[Beetle01]

Yeah it sure is, this all happened in the far far distant past of one week ago.

No one had mentioned the story, so I just thought I would see what people thought.

And dont worry about my electrical use, I do my part to cut back.

It is old news. A slurry busted. How many are in this country, when was the last one to bust? What are the ramifications from this? That is still to be seen. I wish there were easier cleaner ways to get energy, however there currently isn't. So we need to keep working for better energy resources, focus on that, not what is wrong with what we got now. You can't change what we have now, you can change what we use in the future. You do that by replacing coal with a cleaner safer source. One that doesn't destroy our economy with ridiculous utility bills.


Why don't you do your part a little bit more and turn your Pc off.

[Benchwarmer]

Sounds like Tennessee needs better regulations with slurry ponds like the ones Kentucky has.

[Coach_Owens87]

It is old news. A slurry busted. How many are in this country, when was the last one to bust? What are the ramifications from this? That is still to be seen. I wish there were easier cleaner ways to get energy, however there currently isn't. So we need to keep working for better energy resources, focus on that, not what is wrong with what we got now. You can't change what we have now, you can change what we use in the future. You do that by replacing coal with a cleaner safer source. One that doesn't destroy our economy with ridiculous utility bills.


Why don't you do your part a little bit more and turn your Pc off.

Wonderful points, but nothing ever gets changed unless you see what is wrong with what you have. If this system worked perfectly nothing would need to change. If segragation was so good, MLK wouldnt have spoke out, if the british rule was so good in america, the revolutionary war wouldnt have occured. You have to focus on the problems now, so that you will more clearly see the answers for the future.

And im using a laptop PC, so my energy consumption is already taken up, no matter if I turn it off or not.

[guyfawkes]

I do believe that this spill should force tougher penalties on companies who cause this to happen and for a more safer way of disposing coal ash.

[Old School]

"More than a billion gallons of coal fly ash, a byproduct of burning coal, spilled Monday when the dike burst on a retention pond at the Kingston Fossil Plant. The spill covered 300 acres with sludge in Harriman, about 35 miles west of Knoxville. It dumped a mix of ash and water in the Emory River, causing residents of nearby Kingston to worry about their drinking water."

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/arti...wD95C387O0


What was that Old school said about the safety of all these retention ponds?

Lets hear the PR pro coal spin he has to spit out!

Why Coach I'm surprised........you know me and you know the spin stops here! lol

Let's keep this in perspective, remember this was a ash retention pond or if you prefer a dike which was located at the power plant, and is unlike slurry impoundments which require stricter design, construction and inspection guidelines. Unless these ash retention ponds are built on a active mining operation, they are not covered by those standards. Regulation of these ash ponds have been left to state agencies, where standards can vary wdely from state to state.

According to a fact sheet released by TVA the State of Tennessee inspects these ponds quarterly in coordination with the permitting process. Each plant does a visual inspection daily. Plant personnel conduct seep inspection of the dikes quarterly. Detailed inspections of the ash handling and storage dikes are done annually by TVA engineering staff.

[Coach_Owens87]

Why Coach I'm surprised........you know me and you know the spin stops here! lol

Let's keep this in perspective, remember this was a ash retention pond or if you prefer a dike which was located at the power plant, and is unlike slurry impoundments which require stricter design, construction and inspection guidelines. Unless these ash retention ponds are built on a active mining operation, they are not covered by those standards. Regulation of these ash ponds have been left to state agencies, where standards can vary wdely from state to state.

According to a fact sheet released by TVA the State of Tennessee inspects these ponds quarterly in coordination with the permitting process. Each plant does a visual inspection daily. Plant personnel conduct seep inspection of the dikes quarterly. Detailed inspections of the ash handling and storage dikes are done annually by TVA engineering staff.

I dont know how I didn't keep it in perspective, I mentioned in the first post that this was a ash pond, and not a coal sludge pond.

From what I have read, the construction of this pond, and the slurry ponds here are very similar, and have similar safety guidelines. Supposedly they are over designed to handle a massive amount of precipitation in a short period of time, but as this shows, thats not always the case.

[Old School]

I dont know how I didn't keep it in perspective, I mentioned in the first post that this was a ash pond, and not a coal sludge pond.

From what I have read, the construction of this pond, and the slurry ponds here are very similar, and have similar safety guidelines. Supposedly they are over designed to handle a massive amount of precipitation in a short period of time, but as this shows, thats not always the case.

I didn't mean to insinuate that you had not, but to keep it in perspective during future discussions.

Let me assure you that a ash pond and a slurry impoundment are two totally different structures. Regardless both are designed to accommodate their purpose, but like anything else if they are not built and maintained according to the design and all of the precautions are not taken during construction this can happen. As I said I'm not all that familiar with ash ponds, but I think ash ponds are built above ground with a dike completely encircling the pond (similar to a flood wall) and is designed to have water pumped into it and not to control water from rain events. Where as slurry impoundment is designed to have water pumped into it and also to be able to maintain maximum 30 and 40 year rain events. According to article that I have read on this matter ash ponds only have to be approved by the state in which they are located, where as coal slurry impoundments have to follow guidelines established by Surface Mining Control and Reclamation Act (SMCRA) set by Congress in 1977, and be approve by MSHA and State agencies along with the Army Corp of Engineers. I'm not sure of the time frame it takes to have as ash pond approved, but a slurry impoundment will take up to at least 5 years from the beginning to final approval.

Depending on the size of the ash pond the dike surrounding it could be constructed in within a few months, where a coal slurry impoundment could take several years to construct.

According to the fact sheet released by the TVA, "the volume of the Kingston ash pond was within its permitted limits". The fact sheet went on to say, "The most recent annual inspection was conducted in October 2008. The formal report is not complete for this inspection, however a preliminary report shows that a "wet spot" was found, indicating a minor leaking issue. There were no significnt problems found that indicated that the dikes were unstable to the point of failure"

[thecavemaster]

Erin Brockovitch (the actual one) has agreed to investigate and work on behalf of the people impacted by the dam break/sludge flood.

[buster]

have you hugged your tree today

[thecavemaster]

have you hugged your tree today

Have you peed on yours with the acid of sludge and run off and a generally cavalier attitude about the environment?

[Coach_Owens87]

have you hugged your tree today

Nice to see that you have something intelligent to add to this thread buster.

I know you can do better than that old stereotypical ignorant remark.

[buster]

Today we cut a tree so you could build your houses them we went in the mountain and on it to bring you the fuel so you can heat your homes and enjoy all of the other prouducts that come from coal( coumputer chips from the blue gem seam ) ect....

There is a price for comfort how much you are willing to pay is up to each one of us

[Coach_Owens87]

And tomorrow you should learn how to use punctuation.

Thanks for stating the obvious buster, we all know there is a price for comfort, and I never said that we have to give up our entire way of life, I just don't understand why people find it so difficult to find a middle ground where we can live in comfort, and protect our planet, too things everyone should want. But people like you, and the friends of coal lunatics, only see one thing, and it's not the interest of the communities they work in, its profit.

[HAIL PIKEVILLE!]

And tomorrow you should learn how to use punctuation.

OOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHH!!!! Snappy Comeback! Did You hurt yourself coming up with that one?:lmao:

[ImagineThat!]

And tomorrow you should learn how to use punctuation.

Thanks for stating the obvious buster, we all know there is a price for comfort, and I never said that we have to give up our entire way of life, I just don't understand why people find it so difficult to find a middle ground where we can live in comfort, and protect our planet, too things everyone should want. But people like you, and the friends of coal lunatics, only see one thing, and it's not the interest of the communities they work in, its profit.

You might want to proofread your comments before you post something like this.

[Coach_Owens87]

You might want to proofread your comments before you post something like this.

You also may want to not post anything unless you have something productive to add, but I highly doubt you do.


I noticed my spelling error, but by the time I did, it was too (used the right one that time) late to correct it.

[Coach_Owens87]

OOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHH!!!! Snappy Comeback! Did You hurt yourself coming up with that one?:lmao:

Only slightly, but the pain is small compared to what I feel reading most of the ignorant comments on here.

[Beetle01]

Coach, you asked why we couldn't find a middle ground? Because currently there is no middle ground, 50 years from now, maybe. However, to do things as you ask would leave a majority of Americans without the ability to have the comforts mentioned above due to major increases in energy costs. We need to mine and drill while the energy is still feasible, then once we better our understand and ability to use renewabale resources we can make the switch over to those. Until then, might as well use up the endless reserves we have. And they are basically endless for any feasible time frame. 1000+ years on current known reserves, that doesnt count the massive reserves that we dont know about or are currently unable to reach due to technology not quite there yet, but there is an oil reserve in the Atlantic that is currently to deep to access but that holds more oil than all known reserves on Earth combined at this very moment.