[TheRealVille]

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/201...rtificate/

[TheRealVille]

Maybe a mod could fix the title? I meant for it to say, "Obama releases birth certificate".

[Stardust]

You mean to tell me it took this long for them to doctor up an altered BC?????

[LWC]

I saw this on Yahoo! and there were comments from people that said this was a C.O.L.B and not a birth certificate and that it is fake, etc...

Donald Trump didn't help it by saying he wants people to examine it, etc....

[BillyB]

You mean to tell me it took this long for them to doctor up an altered BC?????

It's a good forgery though. That takes a while.

[TidesHoss32]

Well..I, for one will be bringing out the popcorn for this thread, lol..I got buddies on both sides of the Obama lines, but I love seeing them all go at it...Have at it, gentlemen.

[Hoot Gibson]

So, Obama spent well upwards of $1,000,000 to avoid releasing his birth certificate and publicity hound Donald Trump managed to persuade him to release another "certificate of live birth?" Have we ever had a thinner skinned president? Maybe Nixon, but it's a tough call to make.

[TheRealVille]

So, Obama spent well upwards of $1,000,000 to avoid releasing his birth certificate and publicity hound Donald Trump managed to persuade him to release another "certificate of live birth?" Have we ever had a thinner skinned president? Maybe Nixon, but it's a tough call to make.

Hoot, the "birther" type voter is exactly why Obama will get another 4 years. Surely you don't buy into this farce? He has produced the long version of his birth certificate. He was born in America, people need to come up with something valid to vote him out. The "birther" thing has went on long enough. If conservatives don't come up with a better candidate, and quit the foolishness, you can bet your butt Obama will get 4 more years. And no, this version of the BC, even Obama couldn't get a copy of. He didn't spend one dime to keep it hid. That's "Fox News type" propaganda.

[Hoot Gibson]

Hoot, the "birther" type voter is exactly why Obama will get another 4 years. Surely you don't buy into this farce? He has produced the long version of his birth certificate. He was born in America, people need to come up with something valid to vote him out. The "birther" thing has went on long enough. If conservatives don't come up with a better candidate, and quit the foolishness, you can bet your butt Obama will get 4 more years. And no, this version of the BC, even Obama couldn't get a copy of. He didn't spend one dime to keep it hid.

Do you have a reasonable explanation as to why somebody in politics would spend close to a fortune to avoid making his birth certificate public?

The last thing that I would have wanted would have been for Obama to have been found ineligible to serve after taking office. Joe Biden was a great insurance policy against impeachment and I hope that Obama has not set a precedent by putting a dimwit on the ticket.

I don't buy Obama's explanation. If this issue is a foolish distraction, they was it not a foolish distraction last week, last year, or before he paid lawyers more than $1 million to keep if from the public?

However, I am curious about Obama's school records. I would like to see if affirmative action landed him a spot at Columbia and Harvard, despite the fact that he attended very good schools in Hawaii or if Obama really was a good student deserving of an Ivy League education. Bush, Gore, and Kerry all made their transcripts and college entrance scores public during their presidential campaigns. Why has Mr. Transparency not done the same?

[TidesHoss32]

And heeeeeerrrrreeeeee we go:popcorn:

[TheRealVille]

Do you have a reasonable explanation as to why somebody in politics would spend close to a fortune to avoid making his birth certificate public?

The last thing that I would have wanted would have been for Obama to have been found ineligible to serve after taking office. Joe Biden was a great insurance policy against impeachment and I hope that Obama has not set a precedent by putting a dimwit on the ticket.

I don't buy Obama's explanation. If this issue is a foolish distraction, they was it not a foolish distraction last week, last year, or before he paid lawyers more than $1 million to keep if from the public?

However, I am curious about Obama's school records. I would like to see if affirmative action landed him a spot at Columbia and Harvard, despite the fact that he attended very good schools in Hawaii or if Obama really was a good student deserving of an Ivy League education. Bush, Gore, and Kerry all made their transcripts and college entrance scores public during their presidential campaigns. Why has Mr. Transparency not done the same?

Do you have reasonable proof that he did spend a fortune? For me, once he showed the proper authorities that needed to see it, that was all that was required of him. As you know, I'm not an Obama fan, but the "foolish" right wing propaganda isn't going to get him out.

[Hoot Gibson]

Do you have reasonable proof that he did spend a fortune? For me, once he showed the proper authorities that needed to see it, that was all that was required of him. As you know, I'm not an Obama fan, but the "foolish" right wing propaganda isn't going to get him out.

To what "proper authorities" did he show his birth certificate? That never happened. Unfortunately, nothing is legally required of presidential candidates to prove that they are qualified to run for the office.

My question was not a difficult one, RV. Can you think of any reason for a national politician to spend a large sum of money to conceal his birth certificate?

As for not being an Obama fan, you seem to be seeing the light a little more every day but I seem to recall you mounting a very spirited defense of his misguided policies on more than one occasion. As you know, I am definitely not an Obama fan but I have also not chosen to take the "birther" route in opposing him. There are so many excellent reasons for throwing this bum out of office, there is no reason to dwell on something that will not push the ball down the field toward that goal.

However, what I find troubling is the way that "birthers" have been treated by the media. Asking Obama to produce his birth certificate and to release his school records are not unreasonable requests. Other politicians have disclosed the same kind of documents with no fuss - even when some of those records proved somewhat embarrassing. In similar cases, it was the media seeking records such as these. In this case, the media has worked diligently to portray people asking legitimate questions as kooks.

Finally, lest liberals forget - this question was raised during the campaign by Hillary Clinton's camp - not by the Republicans. There was nothing wrong with the questions then and there is nothing wrong with them now.

[TheRealVille]

To what "proper authorities" did he show his birth certificate? That never happened. Unfortunately, nothing is legally required of presidential candidates to prove that they are qualified to run for the office.

My question was not a difficult one, RV. Can you think of any reason for a national politician to spend a large sum of money to conceal his birth certificate?

As for not being an Obama fan, you seem to be seeing the light a little more every day but I seem to recall you mounting a very spirited defense of his misguided policies on more than one occasion. As you know, I am definitely not an Obama fan but I have also not chosen to take the "birther" route in opposing him. There are so many excellent reasons for throwing this bum out of office, there is no reason to dwell on something that will not push the ball down the field toward that goal.

However, what I find troubling is the way that "birthers" have been treated by the media. Asking Obama to produce his birth certificate and to release his school records are not unreasonable requests. Other politicians have disclosed the same kind of documents with no fuss - even when some of those records proved somewhat embarrassing. In similar cases, it was the media seeking records such as these. In this case, the media has worked diligently to portray people asking legitimate questions as kooks.

Finally, lest liberals forget - this question was raised during the campaign by Hillary Clinton's camp - not by the Republicans. There was nothing wrong with the questions then and there is nothing wrong with them now.

As you said, he isn't required to show the public where he is born. I'm sure he has to show somebody proof that he is eligible, less we would have an Iraqi muslim trying to run. Also, you still show no proof that he spent a ton of money to hide it. I have never defended Obama, more than the fact that I vote democrat over republican nowadays.

On the 2nd bold: Correct, the birther stance is not going to get him gone.

On the 3rd bolded, I agree 100%.

[TheRealVille]

And heeeeeerrrrreeeeee we go:popcorn:

Nope, you don't see arguments out of me anymore. I will fold out before I get mad. I think Hoot and I have come to a common respect on politics. We disagree mostly, but I respect him completely for his views, and we do it with respect to each other.

[TheRealVille]

On the President, if you could find a conservative that didn't try to break private unions, he couldn't be beat.

[Hoot Gibson]

As you said, he isn't required to show the public where he is born. I'm sure he has to show somebody proof that he is eligible, less we would have an Iraqi muslim trying to run. Also, you still show no proof that he spent a ton of money to hide it. I have never defended Obama, more than the fact that I vote democrat over republican nowadays.

On the 2nd bold: Correct, the birther stance is not going to get him gone.

On the 3rd bolded, I agree 100%.

Actually, presidential candidates are not currently required to show anybody their birth certificates to prove their eligibility to hold office. Several states are considering legislation to require candidates to establish proof of eligibility before being placed on the ballots in 2012, but a Republican governor recently vetoed such a bill in Arizona. There are no federal laws in this area but individual states have the right to establish rules for getting on the ballot.

Apparently Obama is also not required to provide a detailed account of his legal expenditures. He has spent well over $2 million dollars on personal legal services since he took office but the amount of that total spent on multiple lawsuits concerning his eligibility to hold office is not in the public domain. Hiring top flyte lawyers to represent you in multiple cases across the country is not done on the cheap.

If you don't like the word "fortune," then how about "substantial?" I assumed that Trump's $2 million was exaggerated and but I would be surprised if Obama has not spent half that amount - but nobody but Obama and his army of lawyers can say for sure.

[Hoot Gibson]

Nope, you don't see arguments out of me anymore. I will fold out before I get mad. I think Hoot and I have come to a common respect on politics. We disagree mostly, but I respect him completely for his views, and we do it with respect to each other.

:Thumbs: I won't fold when I believe that I am right but I refuse to get mad debating politics. I also refuse to go too far out on a limb for any politician. Most of them will disappoint us in the end, so it is best just to ride them until they start losing their backbone switching to a fresher horse.

[TheRealVille]

:Thumbs: I won't fold when I believe that I am right but I refuse to get mad debating politics. I also refuse to go too far out on a limb for any politician. Most of them will disappoint us in the end, so it is best just to ride them until they start losing their backbone switching to a fresher horse.

:Thumbs: !00%

[Old School]

IMO, it should have never reached this stage. I think a birth certificate should be required when one fills out the necessary documents to become a candidate not after they have been in office for 2 years.

[TheRealVille]

IMO, it should have never reached this stage. I think a birth certificate should be required when one fills out the necessary documents to become a candidate not after they have been in office for 2 years.

As do I, but that is not the requirement, thus Obama had no obligation to do so. Don't mistake that as me defending him.

As a friend said, "Since Obama had to show his BC, Sarah Palin should have to show her High School Diploma. I have doubts."

[BillyB]

So, Obama spent well upwards of $1,000,000 to avoid releasing his birth certificate and publicity hound Donald Trump managed to persuade him to release another "certificate of live birth?" Have we ever had a thinner skinned president? Maybe Nixon, but it's a tough call to make.

It's just not true, that's why. It started in a WorldNet Daily article which concluded that most or all of Obama's post-election legal fees were related to defending birther lawsuits. That wasn't true.

Read one report

[TidesHoss32]

Nope, you don't see arguments out of me anymore. I will fold out before I get mad. I think Hoot and I have come to a common respect on politics. We disagree mostly, but I respect him completely for his views, and we do it with respect to each other.

Oh no brother..I dont check these threads for the jabs and putdowns back and forth, I love just seeing a good debate unfold. I dont get involved in political forums anymore because of that same reason, lol, so I sit on the bleachers and watch you all break into a good civil debate. Great stuff though from everyone involved..:Thumbs:

[Hoot Gibson]

It's just not true, that's why. It started in a WorldNet Daily article which concluded that most or all of Obama's post-election legal fees were related to defending birther lawsuits. That wasn't true.

Read one report

So, how much has Obama spent since he was elected to conceal his birth certificate? How do you know that what Trump said is not true when the only thing that is known for sure is that Obama has spent upwards of $2 million on legal fees in total since he took office? WND is not a reliable news source but Obama has not exactly been a fountain of truth himself.

[nky]

As do I, but that is not the requirement, thus Obama had no obligation to do so. Don't mistake that as me defending him.

As a friend said, "Since Obama had to show his BC, Sarah Palin should have to show her High School Diploma. I have doubts."

but you don't have to be a high school graduate to be president. You do have to be a natural born citizen

[BillyB]

So, how much has Obama spent since he was elected to conceal his birth certificate?

I'd guess $0. He produced years ago the birth certificate the State of Hawaii gave him. (It's the same form both of my kids have from 2 different states that were good enough for us to get US passports.) Just because some foolish people aren't satisfied with a legitimate birth certificate doesn't mean he "concealed" it.

How do you know that what Trump said is not true when the only thing that is known for sure is that Obama has spent upwards of $2 million on legal fees in total since he took office?

Because Trump hasn't been right yet. According to him the birth certificate was missing. He also said he would produce some "very interesting" information soon. Where is it? It's going to be fun watching him run for the Republican nomination.

How much has John McCain spent since the election? $1.3 million. Is he concealing something?

WND is not a reliable news source but Obama has not exactly been a fountain of truth himself.

Then why are so many people repeating the WND claim? Are they ignorant or do they just not care whether it's true?

[nky]

This whole business has been silly. It was President Obama own fault that it was blown out of proportion and reached this level of absurdity. He looked at the issue as a joke when the Clinton's raised it almost 4 years ago. He permitted it to fester and kept blowing it off. He could have ended it before it began. Was it a lack of vision, leadership, or something else that caused him to take this issue lightly?

[BillyB]

This whole business has been silly. It was President Obama own fault that it was blown out of proportion and reached this level of absurdity. He looked at the issue as a joke when the Clinton's raised it almost 4 years ago. He permitted it to fester and kept blowing it off. He could have ended it before it began. Was it a lack of vision, leadership, or something else that caused him to take this issue lightly?

First, Clinton didn't raise it. A few of her supporters did after it was clear she was going to lose the nomination.

Second, the whole issue didn't merit a response. He produced a legal birth certificate. That should have been the end of it.

[nky]

First, Clinton didn't raise it. A few of her supporters did after it was clear she was going to lose the nomination.

Second, the whole issue didn't merit a response. He produced a legal birth certificate. That should have been the end of it.

1. If it came from the Clinton camp it came from the Clinton's

2. The issue was out there and he should have ended it years ago by doing what he did this week, not letting it fester and grown legs and cross over into conspiracy. Now it will grow even more because of the distrust in government and the ideas of sub government and record manipulations and such.
It was a non issue all along for me- there was a birth announcement in the Honolulu newspaper in August of 1961 announcing his birth. Those announcements come straight from birth registration records. This issue really is one of President Obama own making

[tvtimeout]

This whole thing is silly in my humble opinion. We have an out of control debt, 49% of the country receives some type of government assistance, we are in two wars and one conflict, unemployment is well over 8%, we have uncontrolled boarders, our credit rating has turned negative, we have an import/export problem, dependent on foreign energy, infrastructor in US collasping, becoming an older society, inflation setting in (despite what the fed says), a federal govenment that infringes on our civil liberties in the name of being patriotic (patriot act).

I think this is another side show by both the right and left to take our eyes on what our eyes should be on. Great job by both sides:Clap::please:

[BillyB]

1. If it came from the Clinton camp it came from the Clinton's

2. The issue was out there and he should have ended it years ago by doing what he did this week, not letting it fester and grown legs and cross over into conspiracy. Now it will grow even more because of the distrust in government and the ideas of sub government and record manipulations and such.
It was a non issue all along for me- there was a birth announcement in the Honolulu newspaper in August of 1961 announcing his birth. Those announcements come straight from birth registration records. This issue really is one of President Obama own making

It still isn't over though. Look at the proponents of the issue. They've shifted to new variations of the birther argument. This includes everyone from the Republican presidential front runner all the way down to the crazies who've made a career out of this nonsense.