Hall of Fame

**Stardust** · 05-12-2011, 01:26 PM

Some people are unlikely to enter the HoF due to controversy or personal issues - Randy Savage, Owen Hart and Chris Benoit come to mind. Others, however, simply weren't that good.

As far as I am concerned Koko B. Ware is the bar. He is in the Hall of Fame.
How did he do that? He wasn't just a jobber. He was a jobber with a parrot. To be fair he made enough of an impact to be remembered. So if your legacy is equal to or bigger than Koko's you're in. A feat far from impossible.

But it is actually quite surprising to consider how many people actually fall blow that. I could run down a whole list, but I'll go with the name at the top of my head, which is Andrew "Test" Martin.

Test was there for a couple of years. He was in the mildly successful tag team T&A (which, by the way, was the launching pad for Trish Stratus), he was in that storyline where he was supposed to marry Stephanie, he won a couple of midcard titles, underwent several makeovers (e.g. with Stacey Keibler, when he walked around in what seemed to be blue briefs and called his fans "Testicles" - odd that that didn't catch on) and he had several matches at Wrestlemania.

In the end he was an on again, off again WWE performer, always lacking in charisma, lastly seen ridiculously roided up and putting over Bobby Lashley as the ECW champion.

Soon afterwards he died of substance abuse.

All in all he was there, he got noticed, he achieved this and that, but ultimately he fell short. In my opinion he was not Hall of Fame material.

So, who do you think comes close but doesn't quite get there? I've wanted to talk about this in the past, but never seemed enough interest at BGR

K_Mac · 05-12-2011, 01:31 PM

You know I dont personally have enough knowledge to really make great arguments here but I want to comment on Benoit. If, due to personal issues and alledged stories surrounding his death he doesnt make it, he could be the best ever not to. I was a HUGE Benoit fan, he was awesome IMO. Based on in-ring ability alone, he would be there.

**Stardust** · 05-12-2011, 01:38 PM

^ I agree with you. When I talk wrestling and the greatest in-ring performers of all time, I can't not mention him. But it's hard to even say his name. I was talking to Chris Harris (Wildcat from TNA), last weekend, and he was talking about his short stint in WWE. When he got suspended for drugs, Pat Patterson came up to him and told him that so many guys have been booted from WWE due to substance abuse and the like and Vince just got pissed and told them to get their act together. But now Vince truly cares, and Pat told Chris that they will do everything in their power to keep another "Benoit" incident from happening.

It was interesting to hear it, because it seems like it has now become a locker-room term, but hopefully its something that they guys in the locker room can learn from and help keep an eye on each other.

**LWC** · 05-12-2011, 01:43 PM

With these off the table: Randy Savage, Owen Hart and Chris Benoit, I would have to say, off the top of my head:

Lex Luger
Sting (I don't care if he is current)
Ken Shamrock (King of the Ring, Intercontinental Champ, Tag Team Champ [dual champ], )
Honky Tonk Man

BTW- Benoit, Angle, Malenko and Angle are my favorites ever.

**LWC** · 05-12-2011, 01:47 PM

Add Rick Rude to that list.

.........wait, is this a list of people who should NOT make it?

**Stardust** · 05-12-2011, 01:49 PM

^ Close, but NO CIGAR. Meaning, they are questionable, but don't deserve to get in

**LWC** · 05-12-2011, 01:51 PM

In that case, forget everyone that I said, lol.

Instead put Lance Storm, Gangrel and Bart Gunn on that list.

**Stardust** · 05-12-2011, 01:54 PM

I like the Lance Storm, I think he would be close in potential, but not close enough. I'd say Billy Gunn as close to HOF, but no way Bart. Gangrel only gets consideration because he kicked off the GREATEST comedy team in history as his stooges - Edge and Christian

**Jarons** · 05-12-2011, 01:57 PM

Stardust Wrote:Some people are unlikely to enter the HoF due to controversy or personal issues - Randy Savage, Owen Hart and Chris Benoit come to mind. Others, however, simply weren't that good.

As far as I am concerned Koko B. Ware is the bar. He is in the Hall of Fame.
How did he do that? He wasn't just a jobber. He was a jobber with a parrot. To be fair he made enough of an impact to be remembered. So if your legacy is equal to or bigger than Koko's you're in. A feat far from impossible.

But it is actually quite surprising to consider how many people actually fall blow that. I could run down a whole list, but I'll go with the name at the top of my head, which is Andrew "Test" Martin.

Test was there for a couple of years. He was in the mildly successful tag team T&A (which, by the way, was the launching pad for Trish Stratus), he was in that storyline where he was supposed to marry Stephanie, he won a couple of midcard titles, underwent several makeovers (e.g. with Stacey Keibler, when he walked around in what seemed to be blue briefs and called his fans "Testicles" - odd that that didn't catch on) and he had several matches at Wrestlemania.

In the end he was an on again, off again WWE performer, always lacking in charisma, lastly seen ridiculously roided up and putting over Bobby Lashley as the ECW champion.

Soon afterwards he died of substance abuse.

All in all he was there, he got noticed, he achieved this and that, but ultimately he fell short. In my opinion he was not Hall of Fame material.

So, who do you think comes close but doesn't quite get there? I've wanted to talk about this in the past, but never seemed enough interest at BGR

Why wouldn't he be in the HOF? What kind of issues did he have? I thought he would have been in already.

**LWC** · 05-12-2011, 02:01 PM

Stardust Wrote:I like the Lance Storm, I think he would be close in potential, but not close enough. I'd say Billy Gunn as close to HOF, but no way Bart. Gangrel only gets consideration because he kicked off the GREATEST comedy team in history as his stooges - Edge and Christian

I figured Billy Gunn was a Hall-Of-Fame lock for being one of the greatest tag-teamers ever? Not to mention being in DX and the whole Bill-n-Chuck weirdness. Remember the Hall of Fame is pretty easy, sadly.

**Stardust** · 05-12-2011, 02:01 PM

he walked out on Vince, stiffed him on a PPV and went to WCW where he promptly dissed WWE. Vince is a very forgiving man, but he HATES Savage and Jeff Jarrett and Lex Luger. Even with all the drama between Hogan and Vince, Vince will welcome Hulk back with open arms, but will pee on those three's graves if given the opportunity.

**Jarons** · 05-12-2011, 02:03 PM

Stardust Wrote:he walked out on Vince, stiffed him on a PPV and went to WCW where he promptly dissed WWE. Vince is a very forgiving man, but he HATES Savage and Jeff Jarrett and Lex Luger. Even with all the drama between Hogan and Vince, Vince will welcome Hulk back with open arms, but will pee on those three's graves if given the opportunity.

Does Vince have that much influence on the HOF?

**Stardust** · 05-12-2011, 02:08 PM

^ The only HOF is the WWE HOF. So, with that said, you may never see a guy like Sting go in, or anyone that is exclusive to TNA. It's funny to watch Hogan and Flair on TNA reference there HOF rings on TNA television. I've seen Flair several times say to guys that you will never get one of these, referring to his WWE HOF ring, but he never ever mentions what it it.

K_Mac · 05-14-2011, 03:41 AM

Stardust Wrote:^ I agree with you. When I talk wrestling and the greatest in-ring performers of all time, I can't not mention him. But it's hard to even say his name. I was talking to Chris Harris (Wildcat from TNA), last weekend, and he was talking about his short stint in WWE. When he got suspended for drugs, Pat Patterson came up to him and told him that so many guys have been booted from WWE due to substance abuse and the like and Vince just got pissed and told them to get their act together. But now Vince truly cares, and Pat told Chris that they will do everything in their power to keep another "Benoit" incident from happening.

It was interesting to hear it, because it seems like it has now become a locker-room term, but hopefully its something that they guys in the locker room can learn from and help keep an eye on each other.

You know, SD, I spent over 2 hours today reading about Benoits death and all the facts and conspiracies behind it. Some very interesting reading. It really got me thinking, I mean these conspirators have some really good points. And there are a lot of things that dont make sense.. I realize ur like the Wrestling Guru on here and was wondering what you thought of it all? I considered starting a thread but didnt know if anyone else was interested as I am..

K_Mac · 05-15-2011, 01:18 AM

SD, I was looking forward to your responce to the above statement, and you let me down lol. I guess Ill just have to check in again later..

**Stardust** · 05-15-2011, 07:58 PM

K_Mac Wrote:You know, SD, I spent over 2 hours today reading about Benoits death and all the facts and conspiracies behind it. Some very interesting reading. It really got me thinking, I mean these conspirators have some really good points. And there are a lot of things that dont make sense.. I realize ur like the Wrestling Guru on here and was wondering what you thought of it all? I considered starting a thread but didnt know if anyone else was interested as I am..

K-Mac, you bring up an excellent topic, one that I'd prefer to respond to as part of a debate. Get one started since you put some thought into it. I'm confident this is a GREAT topic and will stir some feelings in some that probably could make this heated or passionate at times.