[Old School]

Does this really surprise anyone? I guess by 2015 we be completely dependent on foreign oil.

The Obama administration is setting the stage for the dismantling of the Trans-Alaska pipeline and poses the greatest threat to its existence today, according to House Natural Resources Committee Chairman Doc Hastings.
The 800-mile pipeline cost $8 billion to construct in the 1970s, and has moved more than 18 billion barrels of crude oil. Three oil companies constructed it, in the face of significant opposition from environmentalists, in response to the 1973 Arab oil embargo.

The federal government approved the pipeline as part of a strategy to secure domestic alternatives to oil from the Middle East. But the Natural Resources Committee notes that the law authorizing the then-controversial pipeline’s construction came with a caveat: If the pipeline should ever cease being viable, it must dismantled.

That day could come within the next decade.

Hastings told The Daily Caller the Trans-Alaska Pipeline remains an important national-security asset today just as it was in the 1970s, because it helps reduce Americans’ dependence on foreign oil.

According to Hastings, the Obama administration has shown a greater interest in appealing to “far-left environmentalists” than in preserving a pipeline that carries approximately 10 percent of the nation’s daily oil output and is responsible for one-third of Alaska’s economic output.

“Basically, what they’re doing is allowing the pipeline to dry up,” Hastings said. “The bottom line is, you need to have a certain flow of oil through the pipeline to keep it viable, especially when it’s wintertime … because [then] you have some infrastructure problems within the pipeline.”

The flow of oil from Prudoe Bay along Alaska’s Northern Slope down to Valdez on the state’s southern coast has steadily declined from its peak of 2.1 million barrels per day in 1988 to approximately 650,000 barrels today.
Published estimates from the federal Energy Information Agency suggest that number could decline to 490,000 barrels per day by 2015, a number low enough to endanger the pipeline’s continuing viability. The agency’s estimate for the year 2030 is just 270,000 barrels per day.

Alaska’s deputy commissioner of the its Department of Natural Resources, Joe Balash, told a congressional subcommittee in June the declining flow of oil through the Trans-Alaska Pipeline threatens to physically clog it, endangering the environment.


http://dailycaller.com/2011/08/25/northe...-10-years/

[TheRealThing]

Does this really surprise anyone? I guess by 2015 we be completely dependent on foreign oil.

The Obama administration is setting the stage for the dismantling of the Trans-Alaska pipeline and poses the greatest threat to its existence today, according to House Natural Resources Committee Chairman Doc Hastings.
The 800-mile pipeline cost $8 billion to construct in the 1970s, and has moved more than 18 billion barrels of crude oil. Three oil companies constructed it, in the face of significant opposition from environmentalists, in response to the 1973 Arab oil embargo.

The federal government approved the pipeline as part of a strategy to secure domestic alternatives to oil from the Middle East. But the Natural Resources Committee notes that the law authorizing the then-controversial pipeline’s construction came with a caveat: If the pipeline should ever cease being viable, it must dismantled.

That day could come within the next decade.

Hastings told The Daily Caller the Trans-Alaska Pipeline remains an important national-security asset today just as it was in the 1970s, because it helps reduce Americans’ dependence on foreign oil.

According to Hastings, the Obama administration has shown a greater interest in appealing to “far-left environmentalists” than in preserving a pipeline that carries approximately 10 percent of the nation’s daily oil output and is responsible for one-third of Alaska’s economic output.

“Basically, what they’re doing is allowing the pipeline to dry up,” Hastings said. “The bottom line is, you need to have a certain flow of oil through the pipeline to keep it viable, especially when it’s wintertime … because [then] you have some infrastructure problems within the pipeline.”

The flow of oil from Prudoe Bay along Alaska’s Northern Slope down to Valdez on the state’s southern coast has steadily declined from its peak of 2.1 million barrels per day in 1988 to approximately 650,000 barrels today.
Published estimates from the federal Energy Information Agency suggest that number could decline to 490,000 barrels per day by 2015, a number low enough to endanger the pipeline’s continuing viability. The agency’s estimate for the year 2030 is just 270,000 barrels per day.

Alaska’s deputy commissioner of the its Department of Natural Resources, Joe Balash, told a congressional subcommittee in June the declining flow of oil through the Trans-Alaska Pipeline threatens to physically clog it, endangering the environment.


http://dailycaller.com/2011/08/25/northe...-10-years/

Our president says one thing and does another. If I didn't know better, just going by his actions alone, I could easily believe Nikita Khrushchev was in the White House.

[TheRealThing]

Since we're talking enery, or lack of it, added to our miseries will soon be the shutdown of 1/5th of all coal fired electrical generating plants within the US. Brownouts, rolling blackouts, loss of jobs all are coming our way. Remember what Mr Obama said during his run for the presidency, "under my plan costs of electricity will neccessarily SKYROCKET" All this is scheduled to take place prior to 2017. God help us, I hope Americans wake up and vote this guy out of office before he totally dismantels any hope of recovery. I really can't see how people will be able to live with energy and food costs tripled and heading toward quadrupled.

[Stardust]

^ Amen brother!

[Old School]

Since we're talking enery, or lack of it, added to our miseries will soon be the shutdown of 1/5th of all coal fired electrical generating plants within the US. Brownouts, rolling blackouts, loss of jobs all are coming our way. Remember what Mr Obama said during his run for the presidency, "under my plan costs of electricity will neccessarily SKYROCKET" All this is scheduled to take place prior to 2017. God help us, I hope Americans wake up and vote this guy out of office before he totally dismantels any hope of recovery. I really can't see how people will be able to live with energy and food costs tripled and heading toward quadrupled.

Not only are they shutting down the power plants they are also making impossible to obtain permits to mine coal. Most environmental groups say they are just trying to stop surface mining, but in reality their actions will adversly effect underground mining.

We all know that the utility companies are going to raise their prices, due to the new regulations. The cost of coal could also skyrocket when the current permits are mined out and no new impoundments permits are issued.

[TheRealVille]

Since we're talking enery, or lack of it, added to our miseries will soon be the shutdown of 1/5th of all coal fired electrical generating plants within the US. Brownouts, rolling blackouts, loss of jobs all are coming our way. Remember what Mr Obama said during his run for the presidency, "under my plan costs of electricity will neccessarily SKYROCKET" All this is scheduled to take place prior to 2017. God help us, I hope Americans wake up and vote this guy out of office before he totally dismantels any hope of recovery. I really can't see how people will be able to live with energy and food costs tripled and heading toward quadrupled.

Coal fired plants have a lifespan of about 40 years. The ones getting shut down right now have run their course. New coal fired plants are being built everywhere right now. More half truths from the right.

[TheRealThing]

Coal fired plants have a lifespan of about 40 years. The ones getting shut down right now have run their course. New coal fired plants are being built everywhere right now. More half truths from the right.

I have some experience in the oil refining industry. We were constantly upgrading, changing pumps, reworking vessels, running new pipe lines, changing out refractories, improving the process is a 24/7 proposition.

I find it extremely unlikely that the same is not true in the power generating industry. The second I heard Ezra Klein's report (boy reporter blogger/fogger in chief for the Washington Post), that 40 year life span jumped out at me. I would have expected you to doubt that yourself RealVille. I know we'll likely never see eye to eye on a broad range of subjects but, industry is industry, maintenance is maintenance and I would say the only thing in the coal fired plants in question that is actually 40 years old are the names over the entrance gates.

This is the nightmare of the liberal pencil necks green agenda come to call. The EPA saving the snail darter kind of thing. I can't resist one little diversion. It's funny all the bleeding heart liberals haven't offered of peep's worth of righteous indignation over the mass slaughter of the Golden Eagles and other raptors killed daily by the rotors of wind mill farms out west. Nothing but crickets from the Hypocrites R Us, earth loving, green gushing, far left. See, out there where all the Maxine Waters and Nancy Pelosi's roam, all one has to do to make reality happen is pass laws and regulations and presto! Wind farms and solar panels aren't governed by the limits of physics, it's magic I tell ya!

Back to coal fired power plants. These guys are going to shut the doors and moth ball those plants, they're history. Even though the lie to get everybody to go along with all this stupidity is that they will just be idled and we'll open them back up if we get in a bind. It's still mind blowing to me that people defend these wacko earth huggers just because they have aligned themselves with the dems. When are we going to evaluate in a real sense what these people are saying to us? As long as a power plant is maintained it can run indefinitely. Let me ask a stupid question. Since these maintaining these plants is a labor intensive proposition, in any case, would it be cheaper to upgrade and maintain all these plants in question or jump up and build new ones? How about keeping the ones we have and adding more plants to ease the pressure on an already stressed US power grid?

[TheRealVille]

I have some experience in the oil refining industry. We were constantly upgrading, changing pumps, reworking vessels, running new pipe lines, changing out refractories, improving the process is a 24/7 proposition.

I find it extremely unlikely that the same is not true in the power generating industry. The second I heard Ezra Klein's report (boy reporter blogger/fogger in chief for the Washington Post), that 40 year life span jumped out at me. I would have expected you to doubt that yourself RealVille. I know we'll likely never see eye to eye on a broad range of subjects but, industry is industry, maintenance is maintenance and I would say the only thing in the coal fired plants in question that is actually 40 years old are the names over the entrance gates.

This is the nightmare of the liberal pencil necks green agenda come to call. The EPA saving the snail darter kind of thing. I can't resist one little diversion. It's funny all the bleeding heart liberals haven't offered of peep's worth of righteous indignation over the mass slaughter of the Golden Eagles and other raptors killed daily by the rotors of wind mill farms out west. Nothing but crickets from the Hypocrites R Us, earth loving, green gushing, far left. See, out there where all the Maxine Waters and Nancy Pelosi's roam, all one has to do to make reality happen is pass laws and regulations and presto! Wind farms and solar panels aren't governed by the limits of physics, it's magic I tell ya!

Back to coal fired power plants. These guys are going to shut the doors and moth ball those plants, they're history. Even though the lie to get everybody to go along with all this stupidity is that they will just be idled and we'll open them back up if we get in a bind. It's still mind blowing to me that people defend these wacko earth huggers just because they have aligned themselves with the dems. When are we going to evaluate in a real sense what these people are saying to us? As long as a power plant is maintained it can run indefinitely. Let me ask a stupid question. Since these maintaining these plants is a labor intensive proposition, in any case, would it be cheaper to upgrade and maintain all these plants in question or jump up and build new ones? How about keeping the ones we have and adding more plants to ease the pressure on an already stressed US power grid?

You can believe it, that's my industry. I maintain and help build powerplants as my job. I am in Somerset putting coal scrubbers on one right now. The average life span of a coal fired unit is around 40 years, maybe get 50. The Louisa plant is shutting one of their units down pretty soon because of it's age, which was built in the 60's because it no longer feasible to keep it running. They are turning the other unit into a gas fired. It was built in the 70's. 2nd bold: No they can't.

[TheRealVille]

The oldest unit in America was built in 1938. There are only a handful of units left that were built before 1950.

[TheRealVille]

[quote=TheRealThing]I have some experience in the oil refining industry. We were constantly upgrading, changing pumps, reworking vessels, running new pipe lines, changing out refractories, improving the process is a 24/7 proposition. Really now? I also work in the construction/ maintenance part of oil refineries. Old refinery units are dying all the time. I have worked in the refinery at Catlettsburg at different times for the last 21 years, and have helped demo several old units that have ran their course. That plant was just built in the late 20's. Yes, you can update equipment for many years, but even at refineries, the units lifespan runs at around 40-50 years.

[TheRealThing]

You still wouldn't just shut Ashland/Marathon down because the rcc got past it's prime. Building new units would be cheaper than mothballing the refinery, right?

In this case, EPA regulations are the immediate threat to close the power plants, not their age, that's just the way they're spinning it to get you on board. The owners will replace the plants as they phase new ones on line unless they are forced to close them because of clean air regulations. So you're telling me that you are for all this then?

You know what is coming as a result of these closings and the loss of power they generate. Electical rates will go up, skyrocket that is. When your hero was on the campaign trail during his run for president he made several statements that really worried me. One was that rates would skyrocket, the other was as a nation we wronly account for up to 67% of the world's total energy consumption yearly. He stated further that we cannot continue to do that. My question is why not? Who is he to decide what the whole nation and it's people should be doing?

I believe he will get some commission to go through the sham of some supposedly credible process to decide how much power is enough for your family to use for a year or a month. This will be a hand picked democratic hit squad and it will all take place behind closed doors of course. In any event, soon your utilities will be enormously expensive because regulations will choke the life out the free enterprize practices that at one time guaranteed you and yours cheap gas, electricity, natural gas, water and you name it. If your power usage for a month runs more than your allotment, ration or what ever you want to call it, the penalty will be an outrageous exponential kilowatt hour surcharge. Most people won't be able to pay for anything past their allotment. Life as we know it will be gone. Any extra power usage will be a chilling prospect as things like pool pumps, hot showers, air conditioning and a host of other things that most Americans have taken for granted for their entire lifetime will be gone, priced out of feasibility by one guy who thinks he should decide how your life will be from here on out.

Those things are included in the list of civil liberties and freedoms we now enjoy even though they are threatened. So blinded by your contempt for republicans you are willing to regress 70 years in time and give up everything you've worked for? It won't be just energy. 401k's and pensions will shrink into a mere shadow of what they once were.

When the our government starts shutting down industry for the sake of their idea of clean air while EVERY other nation on earth doesn't try to help a bit, it's over. Do you really support that? All this happening while we sit on enough fossil fuel to power our country for hundreds of years. It's got to be the most rediculous thing I've ever heard. I don't know about your house but, when I step out in the morning the air is sweet and clean. Present industry standards that control pollutants are far and away more stringent than the world around us. Obama wants us to lead by example by giving up our way of life. For me, it just takes more than one bozo from Kenya to get me to totally give up everything I've worked for and forsake the American dream just because he thinks he wants to redefine what that should be.

[TidesHoss32]

Since we're talking enery, or lack of it, added to our miseries will soon be the shutdown of 1/5th of all coal fired electrical generating plants within the US. Brownouts, rolling blackouts, loss of jobs all are coming our way. Remember what Mr Obama said during his run for the presidency, "under my plan costs of electricity will neccessarily SKYROCKET" All this is scheduled to take place prior to 2017. God help us, I hope Americans wake up and vote this guy out of office before he totally dismantels any hope of recovery. I really can't see how people will be able to live with energy and food costs tripled and heading toward quadrupled.

Never underestimate the ignorance of the American people.

[Bob Seger]

Never underestimate the ignorance of the American people.

I think the word "stupidity" is interchangable with that as well, as we see evidenced by a handful posters in this very forum. One can say that "truer words have never been spoken".

[TheRealVille]

I think the word "stupidity" is interchangable with that as well, as we see evidenced by a handful posters in this very forum. One can say that "truer words have never been spoken".

As evidenced by the religious people here that think god is going to destroy the world anyway, "let's just not worry about the damage we are doing." I fully expect to have decendants living tens of thousands of years from now, I'm all for cleaning up the air and cutting down on green house gases.

[TheRealVille]

The newer coal units that are putting on scrubbers to clean up their act I am in full support of, but the older dinosaurs need to be decommissioned and shut down.

[TheRealVille]

You still wouldn't just shut Ashland/Marathon down because the rcc got past it's prime. Building new units would be cheaper than mothballing the refinery, right?

In this case, EPA regulations are the immediate threat to close the power plants, not their age, that's just the way they're spinning it to get you on board. The owners will replace the plants as they phase new ones on line unless they are forced to close them because of clean air regulations. So you're telling me that you are for all this then?

You know what is coming as a result of these closings and the loss of power they generate. Electical rates will go up, skyrocket that is. When your hero was on the campaign trail during his run for president he made several statements that really worried me. One was that rates would skyrocket, the other was as a nation we wronly account for up to 67% of the world's total energy consumption yearly. He stated further that we cannot continue to do that. My question is why not? Who is he to decide what the whole nation and it's people should be doing?

I believe he will get some commission to go through the sham of some supposedly credible process to decide how much power is enough for your family to use for a year or a month. This will be a hand picked democratic hit squad and it will all take place behind closed doors of course. In any event, soon your utilities will be enormously expensive because regulations will choke the life out the free enterprize practices that at one time guaranteed you and yours cheap gas, electricity, natural gas, water and you name it. If your power usage for a month runs more than your allotment, ration or what ever you want to call it, the penalty will be an outrageous exponential kilowatt hour surcharge. Most people won't be able to pay for anything past their allotment. Life as we know it will be gone. Any extra power usage will be a chilling prospect as things like pool pumps, hot showers, air conditioning and a host of other things that most Americans have taken for granted for their entire lifetime will be gone, priced out of feasibility by one guy who thinks he should decide how your life will be from here on out.

Those things are included in the list of civil liberties and freedoms we now enjoy even though they are threatened. So blinded by your contempt for republicans you are willing to regress 70 years in time and give up everything you've worked for? It won't be just energy. 401k's and pensions will shrink into a mere shadow of what they once were.

When the our government starts shutting down industry for the sake of their idea of clean air while EVERY other nation on earth doesn't try to help a bit, it's over. Do you really support that? All this happening while we sit on enough fossil fuel to power our country for hundreds of years. It's got to be the most rediculous thing I've ever heard. I don't know about your house but, when I step out in the morning the air is sweet and clean. Present industry standards that control pollutants are far and away more stringent than the world around us. Obama wants us to lead by example by giving up our way of life. For me, it just takes more than one bozo from Kenya to get me to totally give up everything I've worked for and forsake the American dream just because he thinks he wants to redefine what that should be.

:thatsfunn :hilarious: Are you sure you and Hoot aren't brothers?

[Hoot Gibson]

:thatsfunn :hilarious: Are you sure you and Hoot aren't brothers?

One might ask the same question of you and Barack. If Obama were paying his excuse makers, you would be a very wealthy man.

[Hoot Gibson]

Obama promised that any company that built new coal-fired power plants would go bankrupt and he intends to keep that promise. Shutting down the Alaskan Pipeline is just part of this socialist regime's program of destroying our nation's industrial base. Obama is doing the work that the Soviets could only dream of doing.

[TheRealThing]

:thatsfunn :hilarious: Are you sure you and Hoot aren't brothers?

It's a small wonder why you are a strong supporter of the left if you don't think it will boil down to allotments and money. How do you think energy usage will be controlled by "big brother" if not by money? Try to get a grip on what your master has said---quote "under my plan the costs of electricity would neccessarily skyrocket." END QUOTE In the industry or not, everybody knows they are and have been regulated by a usage meter, that's how the utility concern determines how much your bill is for the month. If he can enact legislation which forces the citizens of America en masse to buy medical insurance he can regulate how much electricity you use there at get real ville. And, he will make sure you don't go over your alloted amount by charging you a fortune for your overages.

You will be watching and trimming every possibility to curb your power usage and your life will be completely different. And, I suppose you don't think the move by Obama and the greenwits against fracking to get at the natural gas to use in the new gas fired units will hurt anything either? His goal is to limit energy usage. His rationale could concievably be almost anything but, I'm sure all you supporters will go along with it no matter how stupid it is.

That is unless the 79% of America that are not card carrying liberal zombies show up and vote in 2012. That will give Perry or someone else with a clue 8 years to clean up all this Orwellian madness.