[TidesHoss32]

^ TidesHoss, thank you for the compliment and I respect your post as well. What you are seeing is hypocrisy and this is the exact same stuff that Jesus dealt with during his time. Notice the story in the Bible about the prostitute where he said, "He who is without sin cast the first stone." I will openly tell you that I sin, just like Truth had said. I cuss when I shouldn't, I don't drink/smoke but I eat horribly which is just as bad, and I can't even count how many times I screw up in a day. However, I do not support what I do...I trace this back to Romans 7:15 where Paul talks about how he does not like to sin but he does it anyway.

We are used to the American standards. People here do not forgive. They will get on the internet and bash people to no end over something. Whether it be a movie star getting into drugs, a politician having an affair, or whichever. They will judge them to no end. However, in God's eyes, stealing a 25 cent pack of gum, showing anger, or gossip/slander would be just as bad as those sins. It's just like homosexuality. In his eyes, it's no worse or better than any of the previously mentioned, but it's a sin.

I do especially agree about people needing to get off their butts. That is a major, major weakness with a lot of Christians and I know God is not happy about that. I think of what Truth said about purchasing a lottery ticket or drinking every now and then and he will be an example of what I am about to say. He may do that every now and then, but I would be he is one of these people that are out doing stuff for their community and making a difference. No matter what we do, how hard we try, we cannot live up to the standards of the Bible and anyone that claims they can is telling a big, fat, lie.

To many people, this problem with some Christians acting arrogant, lazy, and judgmental is new. It has actually been a major problem that has gone all the way back to the times of Jesus. Jesus never yelled at any of the sinners in the Bible or judged them. In fact, he always reached out to them and said that "it is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick." The only people he DID yell at were the religious leaders, who were turning people away because of their financial status or other lame reasons.

Excellent post, my friend. I agree with you on what you said about Truth as well. I wasnt implying that he wasnt a good person at all. I would dare say that we all agree that there are way too many "Cafeteria Christians" though..Whats funny, is that other than this, I agree with you, Truth, Seger, Hoot, Dusty, TRT 99 out of 100 times, lol...I do want to point out that, although we may not agree on this subject, I dont feel strongly enough about it to make so much as a whimper about it in public. If it passed, so be it. If it didnt, so be it. But I wouldnt stop what I was doing to support their cause.. :Thumbs:

[RunItUpTheGut]

Well, before anybody makes assumptions about my stance, please let me ALSO say that although I do believe in God and the resurrection, in the same breath, I will admit that I am at odds with some of the normal Christian beliefs. Dont question God? WHY? I would like to know answers instead of getting the "because its in the Bible" answer everytime I ask. Explain to me, WHY this happens or that happens. I didnt say that I am gonna go toe to toe with Him. I live my life constantly wanting to learn new things. I have read the Bible. I said I do not condone homosexuality, but many of you are talking about "picking and choosing what they believe in, what they stand up for", and yet you want to talk about Cafeteria Christians? Truth, Dusty, Wideright, first and foremost, I respect you all A LOT, but 90% of your Cafeteria Christians attend Church every Sunday morning, and are BY FAR the most hypocritical people walking the face of the earth. I have learned over the past ten years, that you CANNOT depend on the Church for ANYTHING. I cannot respect "Christians" that are praising God on facebook, or are out in public pointing fingers at those that do wrong, gossiping relentlessly about other people, and I honestly cannot think of ONE SINGLE THING they do in public that is POSITIVE, BUT, they are good and decent people because they go to church every Sunday, so that makes them a Christian.. When I worked for three summers helping my aunt build houses and do work for people, I was to charge a pastor (who at the time was driving a newer Lincoln Town Car and living in a beautiful home) $120 for four hours of labor and work I done on his wiring and outlets. Know what I got? I got $45 and a "The Lord will Bless you for this" quote. I told him he was $75 short, and wrote him out a bill, which he never paid. In my eyes, that pastor is nothing more than a good for nothing THIEF. I know this is common in that line of work, and I know that all Christians arent like that, BUT this guy was a PASTOR using the Lord to his advantage, for his convenience. During the tornado relief, I will say there were VERY few churches (out of well over 20 that I visited in this area) that helped (by sending food, money, supplies, etc). I am thankful, and grateful for those few churches. If these able bodied Christians would get off of their butts and do something in the community instead of pointing and gossiping and worrying about their drama teams, then I would give them five minutes of my time to hear what they have to say. I cannot respect church members that do not go see the elderly people (Cant cook, give money or help with the drama team? We dont need you anymore!), and I can tell you that the people in the churches know this is a problem. I am NOT a Cafeteria Christian. I do NOT regularly attend Church (most of the people here go to church just to be seen in the public eye anyway). And unless its about some pillhead junkie stealing off of an elderly person, or I hear of a child being molested or something like that, then I wont pass judgement on someone, and whether anyone on this forum wants to admit it or not, WE ALL HAVE PASSED JUDGEMENT and we do it every single day. I do it everyday I hear of something horrible like that mentioned above. I honestly and truthfully try my absolute best every single day of my LIFE to do good things for those that are less fortunate, and that is a promise Ive made to the people that love me, and to God himself. God knows all to well that I have my faults, but I believe that He knows I am a very good person that has done, currently is doing, and Lord willing, will be able to continue to do good works. I have dedicated my life to helping those in need, and to helping our Veterans. I would rather do what I am doing, and thats just trying to be a good, decent person, than to be able bodied, go to church every Sunday, and not do one single thing to help those in need, or to even make the time to GO SEE someone that needs company. I know whats in the Bible, and I know gay marriage is wrong, but if those people are good enough to go into the military, and go to war for all of us, then let them marry. A sin is a sin, right? Its no different than these Cafeteria Christians having premarital sex, or living together without being married and attending Church on Sunday. Compared to the other problems we have in this country, in my opinion anyways, this is minor.

IMHO, the only way to really believe in God is to first question it, then doubt it.
It's simple human nature. It's what you believe after the fact tha makes you a chrisitian or not.

[Bob Seger]

^ That's fair TH32, and I respect you. I'm a very open person, and I do not let those around me - BOTHER me! However, what I support versus is very different than what I ignore. And what I ignore is 100% what makes me guilty as a Christian. You said you are a christian. If so, then I'm confused by your comment that you support it. The Bible is clear that marriage is between a man and a woman. The Bible is clear that homosexuality as an immoral, abomination, and declares homosexual desires and actions to be shameful, unnatural, lustful, and indecent. The Bible's condemnation of homosexuality is at the exact same level as beastiality! I no more will support homosexuality than I would the Mexican Woman who gets her Butt womped by a Donkey in Tijuana! Same thing.

Your comments are 100% right about divorce, but fix divorce issues. How, by becoming a better christian! Why, because "Man's" first tendency is SIN! Thus, it is always easier for a man to fall to sin than it is to Christ. You issue on the whole divorce side is weakened by not pointing out that what makes man happy as a man ( which means both man and woman) is to lust, thus fornicate, thus divorce. That's the sin, and it comes natural to sin. Thus, if you are a christian, you are right to not support those sins. Then if you do not support those sins that makes man "happy", then you cannot support a man who sleeps with a man, or a woman who sleeps with a woman, because those are sins, and they are easy for those individuals to do!

Do you feel that it's OK to screw a Donkey - If you LOVE that Donkey? Even if you truly believe you love that Donkey??? Same thing, so you would have to support those who engage with Sheep as you do with a Man who loves a Pig in his Blanket!

I appreciate your view, but if you are going to say you are a christian, then I'm confused by your stance!

Beautifully put Dusty.

[TheRealVille]

^ That's fair TH32, and I respect you. I'm a very open person, and I do not let those around me - BOTHER me! However, what I support versus is very different than what I ignore. And what I ignore is 100% what makes me guilty as a Christian. You said you are a christian. If so, then I'm confused by your comment that you support it. The Bible is clear that marriage is between a man and a woman. The Bible is clear that homosexuality as an immoral, abomination, and declares homosexual desires and actions to be shameful, unnatural, lustful, and indecent. The Bible's condemnation of homosexuality is at the exact same level as beastiality! I no more will support homosexuality than I would the Mexican Woman who gets her Butt womped by a Donkey in Tijuana! Same thing.

Your comments are 100% right about divorce, but fix divorce issues. How, by becoming a better christian! Why, because "Man's" first tendency is SIN! Thus, it is always easier for a man to fall to sin than it is to Christ. You issue on the whole divorce side is weakened by not pointing out that what makes man happy as a man ( which means both man and woman) is to lust, thus fornicate, thus divorce. That's the sin, and it comes natural to sin. Thus, if you are a christian, you are right to not support those sins. Then if you do not support those sins that makes man "happy", then you cannot support a man who sleeps with a man, or a woman who sleeps with a woman, because those are sins, and they are easy for those individuals to do!

Do you feel that it's OK to screw a Donkey - If you LOVE that Donkey? Even if you truly believe you love that Donkey??? Same thing, so you would have to support those who engage with Sheep as you do with a Man who loves a Pig in his Blanket!

I appreciate your view, but if you are going to say you are a christian, then I'm confused by your stance!

The bible isn't the United States law book.



Apples and oranges. Animals don't vote or pay taxes, and aren't citizens like you and I. Gay people are and do. They are just as much as citizen with the same rights and privileges as you and I.

[Hoot Gibson]

The bible isn't the United States law book.



Apples and oranges. Animals don't vote or pay taxes, and aren't citizens like you and I. Gay people are and do. They are just as much as citizen with the same rights and privileges as you and I.

A government sanctioned marriage is not a constitutional right for anybody, regardless of their sexual orientation. It never has been. The folks who wrote the U.S. Constitution could never envisioned that anybody would try to redefine marriage to include couples of the same sex but marriage was always considered a state matter until the advent of the federal income tax and the creation of exemptions.

[Bob Seger]

The bible isn't the United States law book.



Apples and oranges. Animals don't vote or pay taxes, and aren't citizens like you and I. Gay people are and do. They are just as much as citizen with the same rights and privileges as you and I.

What does any of that have to do with what Dusty said?

[TheRealVille]

Obama is right along side with the majority of Americans on favoring gay marriage.


[Image: http://sas-origin.onstreammedia.com/orig...h-1u-q.gif]

[Truth]

Obama is right along side with the majority of Americans on favoring gay marriage.


[Image: http://sas-origin.onstreammedia.com/orig...h-1u-q.gif]

You have been watching Rachel Maddow and the others on MSNBC too much. If a majority of our citizens support same sex marriage, why have all 32 states who have addressed it on the ballot voted overwhelmingly against same sex marriage?

You polls are nothing when compared to the actual elections by the people. And, we all know that we can rig the outcome of a poll by the way we word the question. You, Rachel, Hillary Rosen, and their "girl" friends lose on this one.

[TheRealThing]

You have been watching Rachel Maddow and the others on MSNBC too much. If a majority of our citizens support same sex marriage, why have all 32 states who have addressed it on the ballot voted overwhelmingly against same sex marriage?

You polls are nothing when compared to the actual elections by the people. And, we all know that we can rig the outcome of a poll by the way we word the question. You, Rachel, Hillary Rosen, and their "girl" friends lose on this one.

They run right over the facts, truth. Everything is some kind of rationalization with them (liberal/progressives).

[TheRealVille]

You have been watching Rachel Maddow and the others on MSNBC too much. If a majority of our citizens support same sex marriage, why have all 32 states who have addressed it on the ballot voted overwhelmingly against same sex marriage?

You polls are nothing when compared to the actual elections by the people. And, we all know that we can rig the outcome of a poll by the way we word the question. You, Rachel, Hillary Rosen, and their "girl" friends lose on this one.

The question is there for you to plainly see in the graph. There haven't been many elections by the people on this subject.

[Truth]

The question is there for you to plainly see in the graph. There haven't been many elections by the people on this subject.

Graphs don't vote- at least not yet although I'm sure your boy is working on it. The vote of 32 states against same sex marriage cannot be disputed. You can't win this argument because there is nothing to argue.

[TheRealThing]

Graphs don't vote- at least not yet although I'm sure your boy is working on it. The vote of 32 states against same sex marriage cannot be disputed. You can't win this argument because there is nothing to argue.

Thirty states have a constitutional ban restricting marriage to one man and one woman. Those states are

•Alabama
•Alaska
•Arizona
•Arkansas
•California (with the passage of Prop 8)
•Colorado
•Florida
•Georgia
•Kansas
•Kentucky
•Idaho
•Louisiana
•Michigan
•Mississippi
•Missouri
•Montana
•Nebraska
•Nevada
•North Carolina
•North Dakota
•Ohio
•Oklahoma
•Oregon
•South Carolina
•South Dakota
•Tennessee
•Texas
•Utah
•Virginia
•Wisconsin

The following states have laws that ban gay marriage and limit marriage to one man and one woman (but it is not in their constitutions):

•Arizona-- listed above (dual statutes)
•Delaware
•Florida
•Hawaii
•Illinois
•Indiana
•Iowa
•Maine
•Maryland
•Minnesota
•North Carolina-- listed above (dual statutes)
•Pennsylvania
•Washington
•West Virginia
•Wyoming

From what I can find out there have been at least 28 state elections on the matter by popular vote and the record is 28-0 against.

[TheRealVille]

Thirty states have a constitutional ban restricting marriage to one man and one woman. Those states are

•Alabama
•Alaska
•Arizona
•Arkansas
•California (with the passage of Prop 8)
•Colorado
•Florida
•Georgia
•Kansas
•Kentucky
•Idaho
•Louisiana
•Michigan
•Mississippi
•Missouri
•Montana
•Nebraska
•Nevada
•North Carolina
•North Dakota
•Ohio
•Oklahoma
•Oregon
•South Carolina
•South Dakota
•Tennessee
•Texas
•Utah
•Virginia
•Wisconsin

The following states have laws that ban gay marriage and limit marriage to one man and one woman (but it is not in their constitutions):

•Arizona-- listed above (dual statutes)
•Delaware
•Florida
•Hawaii
•Illinois
•Indiana
•Iowa
•Maine
•Maryland
•Minnesota
•North Carolina-- listed above (dual statutes)
•Pennsylvania
•Washington
•West Virginia
•Wyoming

From what I can find out there have been at least 28 state elections on the matter by popular vote and the record is 28-0 against.

Show me where they had a vote on it, and the people voted. A lot of these states have had this on the books for years, and no vote has been brought up as of late. The elected officials have made most of these laws, but the voters haven't had it brought before them recently.

[WideRight05]

^ If you saw the news recently, North Carolina.

[TheRealVille]

^ If you saw the news recently, North Carolina.

That's one.

[SKINNYPIG]

Out of 50 states, how many have accepted/legalized same sex marriage?

[TheRealThing]

^Six states: Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, and Vermont, plus Washington, D.C. recognize gay marriage. All six states have either legislated it into existence or it has been ruled legal by the courts. There has never been a voter referendum in favor of gay marriage in any state whatever.

As of May 2012, with the passing of North Carolina's gay marriage ban, 12 states prohibit same-sex marriage via statute and 30 via the state's constitution.

What's the main point of this argument RV? I don't remember a referendum on the US Constitution or any State Constitution. If you're advocating putting up everything now on the books for a referendum, we may be more at odds than I first thought.

[RunItUpTheGut]

I'm fine with letting the states decide.
Gay Marriage is something we will never have to worry about in KY, IMO.