[ronald reagan]

In 2008's debate, Biden sited gas prices as being too high and used it as his arguement that he should be elected. The catch? That day it was $3.17 nationally..... Today its $3.82. With $6.00 prices seen in California.

I wonder what he'll say in the upcoming debate? Its Bush's fault if I were guessing. Right TRV?

[TheRealVille]

In 2008's debate, Biden sited gas prices as being too high and used it as his arguement that he should be elected. The catch? That day it was $3.17 nationally..... Today its $3.82. With $6.00 prices seen in California.

I wonder what he'll say in the upcoming debate? Its Bush's fault if I were guessing. Right TRV?

Have you got some kind of infatuation with me? I am 100% for gay rights, the same as you, but I am straight and married, if that's what's on your mind.

[ronald reagan]

Have you got some kind of infatuation with me? I am 100% for gay rights, the same as you, but I am straight and married, if that's what's on your mind.

I'm actually about to denouce my support of Gay marriage. Was in the middle of posting it, no joke. So i'm glad you brought that up. I'll just do it here instead.

I really dug deep into the issue last night, did some reading in both the bible and founding fathers, along with talk with several influential spiritual advisors of mine over the past few days. I have came to the conclusion that although my intentions were good, I was wrong. I no longer can support gay marriage in good faith. I thought about it in regards to my own views on abortion and the death penalty. I error on the side of caution. I'm not for abortion particularly because I can't prove that murder is not being committed, thus am not willing to take that chance and support it, condone it, or participate in it otherwise. Death penalty views are influenced the same way. I'm not willing to put to death someone that is innocent, even if its 1 outta a thousand or so that it happens to. I love life and will not take another, except in defense of mine or another. I'd not even take a life to save many more. Gay marriage flew in the face of this rationale. Biblically speaking, and because I'm deeply spiritual as well as religious, I came to the understanding that the issue was either explicitly/implicitly wrong, or not clear enough for me to safely venture into the area of support that I've once shown. Like the bishops that fell to their knees at Vactican 1 when they saw the overwhelming vote on Infallibility that they had opposed... they simply said, "Now I believe." I'm not entirely opposed at this point, but can not and will not continue to try to advance or otherwise support the issue. Freedom is extremely important to me, but salvation is more so. I'm completely tolerant, and will remain so. What homosexuals do in their own time is completely up to them and I'll not be busting down doors like I was in Iraq... searching for sodomizers.... but I'll not be attending any civil ceremony's either.

There.... shewwww..... A weight has been lifted. Like WildcatK23, I just couldn't continue down the path I was on, given the obvious evidence. I thank those who helped guide me to the view I now have... HVR, WR and others. I also apologize for any posts on the matter that may have offended anyone. I feel.... 'home' now.

[Wildcatk23]

I don't support gay marriage but in not for it either. It has nothing to do with me and the government shouldn't tell someone how they should and can live.

As for abortion I only support it in the case of rape. Incest or any other case is not an exception. A woman should have to live with her choices.

As for your salvation. I don't think that has anything to do with how anyone else lives. That is completely between you and god. How someone else lives does not affect your faith.

[Harry Rex Vonner]

Biden is senile.

[TheRealThing]

I don't support gay marriage but in not for it either. It has nothing to do with me and the government shouldn't tell someone how they should and can live.
As for abortion I only support it in the case of rape. Incest or any other case is not an exception. A woman should have to live with her choices.

As for your salvation. I don't think that has anything to do with how anyone else lives. That is completely between you and god. How someone else lives does not affect your faith.

Agreed, no reservation. The government shouldn't tell folks how to live, I shouldn't, you shouldn't nobody should. However, It's a whole nother deal to legalize gay marriage. It's at that point, in which man sets himself over the God who spoke this universe into existence and writes laws which circumvent God's law. My case has and always will be this; we as voters cannot support government officials who do this kind of thing by voting for them, knowing the judgement awaits us all.

[Harry Rex Vonner]

Yes. Biden proved that he isw clearly senile. Send him and his dumba**ed smile to the nursing home.

[LWC]

I agree with personal liberty and the government, for the most part, leaving freedom and liberty to the individual for their choices to fail or to succeed.

With that said though, a human life is not a choice to me. I have to consider the freedom of the life inside of that person. They cannot choose for themselves, someone has to be their advocate.

[TheRealVille]

I agree with personal liberty and the government, for the most part, leaving freedom and liberty to the individual for their choices to fail or to succeed.

With that said though, a human life is not a choice to me. I have to consider the freedom of the life inside of that person. They cannot choose for themselves, someone has to be their advocate.

That's my point LWC. Republicans use abortion as a talking point to get elected. I used to fall for that, but it is just that, a talking point. They don't do anything, and won't. I finally woke up, and figured out that I was going to not be swayed by their abortion smoke screen. Legal abortion is here to stay. It just is. Neither party wants it to leave, because democrats are for it, and republicans can't run without it.

[Harry Rex Vonner]

Have you got some kind of infatuation with me? I am 100% for gay rights, the same as you, but I am straight and married, if that's what's on your mind.

No one is infatuated with you. We are merely amused by your Neanderthal philosophy. You are an easy whipping boy.

[TheRealVille]

No one is infatuated with you. We are merely amused by your Neanderthal philosophy. You are an easy whipping boy.

You would be very interested in what your "partner in crime" thinks of you.

[ronald reagan]

You would be very interested in what your "partner in crime" thinks of you.

HRV knows that him and i butted heads. You may post the entire PM if you'd like.

I've now had a complete change of heart in regards to things dealing with gay marriage, where him and I butted heads. I've also seen that you are an habitual 'mistake' maker, and learned that you're completely unable to think rationally. This has led me to reevaluate my stance in regards to how I feel about others.

Quit alluding to something that HRV already knows.

[ronald reagan]

:Thumbs:

That's my point LWC. Republicans use abortion as a talking point to get elected. I used to fall for that, but it is just that, a talking point. They don't do anything, and won't. I finally woke up, and figured out that I was going to not be swayed by their abortion smoke screen. Legal abortion is here to stay. It just is. Neither party wants it to leave, because democrats are for it, and republicans can't run without it.

There you go again.

I posted a list of things republicans have done to oppose abortion, limit abortion, and overturn Roe V. Wade. I'll refresh your memory. You just refuse to admit the progress that has been made in the past 10 years or so on this issue. Fact is, some states have began the process of restricting abortion to almost none.... in an attempt to have liberals challenge it in court and then have the opportunity for the supreme court to review the case of roe v wade, and have it overturned.

Partial birth abortion ban.
24 hour waiting period.
Parental consent.
Marital consent.
Ultrasound viewing.
Counseling.
Pro-life justices.

Thats just off the top of my head.

But once again, you can't make up on your mind. The above post alludes to you wanting abortion banned, but republicans didn't get it done. But the rest of your posts are continually spinning your view, "cause its legal", "i don't support it.", 'well, only when its 'viable" etc....

Legal abortion is NOT here to stay. It will be repealed by the end of the decade. Then you will support it, because its the law. I don't know what study you have done on abortion and the judicial system, but even Biden was talking about the next terms retiree's on the court, and that republicans could install the needed judges to get it overturned. Obviously he's concerned. You shouldn't be though, because you oppose abortion personally, and only support it because its legal. The supreme court can reverse itself, and its possibly only one justice away getting it done. Go whistle in the dark and keeep your spirits up. I know how it works though. And I know it'll be reversed by the end of the decade. Here's the deal, even ultra radical liberals who support abortion on demand at any stage agree that RvW was 'bad law'. Do your research before you speak. Even the actual writer of the majority opinion of the court later said that his opinion has been misconstrued and it wasn't meant to allow abortion on demand. This alone is grounds to review the decision. And with the extra votes that Mitt Romney says he'll install.... Its doomed. And then you can proudly join us that oppose it, 'because its ILLEGAL'.

[TheRealThing]

:Thumbs:

There you go again.

I posted a list of things republicans have done to oppose abortion, limit abortion, and overturn Roe V. Wade. I'll refresh your memory. You just refuse to admit the progress that has been made in the past 10 years or so on this issue. Fact is, some states have began the process of restricting abortion to almost none.... in an attempt to have liberals challenge it in court and then have the opportunity for the supreme court to review the case of roe v wade, and have it overturned.

Partial birth abortion ban.
24 hour waiting period.
Parental consent.
Marital consent.
Ultrasound viewing.
Counseling.
Pro-life justices.

Thats just off the top of my head.

But once again, you can't make up on your mind. The above post alludes to you wanting abortion banned, but republicans didn't get it done. But the rest of your posts are continually spinning your view, "cause its legal", "i don't support it.", 'well, only when its 'viable" etc....

Legal abortion is NOT here to stay. It will be repealed by the end of the decade. Then you will support it, because its the law. I don't know what study you have done on abortion and the judicial system, but even Biden was talking about the next terms retiree's on the court, and that republicans could install the needed judges to get it overturned. Obviously he's concerned. You shouldn't be though, because you oppose abortion personally, and only support it because its legal. The supreme court can reverse itself, and its possibly only one justice away getting it done. Go whistle in the dark and keeep your spirits up. I know how it works though. And I know it'll be reversed by the end of the decade. Here's the deal, even ultra radical liberals who support abortion on demand at any stage agree that RvW was 'bad law'. Do your research before you speak. Even the actual writer of the majority opinion of the court later said that his opinion has been misconstrued and it wasn't meant to allow abortion on demand. This alone is grounds to review the decision. And with the extra votes that Mitt Romney says he'll install.... Its doomed. And then you can proudly join us that oppose it, 'because its ILLEGAL'.

Um, maybe not so much, here is Biden's statement; VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN: "The court -- the next president will get one or two Supreme Court nominees. That’s how close Roe v. Wade is.

Just ask yourself: With Robert Bork being the chief adviser on the court for -- for Mr. Romney, who do you think he’s likely to appoint? Do you think he’s likely to appoint someone like Scalia or someone else on the court, far right, that would outlaw Planned -- excuse me -- outlaw abortion? I suspect that would happen.

I guarantee you that will not happen. We picked two people. We picked people who are open-minded. They’ve been good justices. So keep an eye on the Supreme Court --"


I must admit, I have a little touble keeping up with Biden's ramblings. What's your take on the enlarged portion of his statement? Is he not saying that under a second Obama term he could guarantee that will not happen? To me he was trying to reel back in the wandering female vote they think they have lost to Romney as the result of his strong performance in the 1st debate. If he is concerned, why is he still aiding and abetting forces or outcomes he is opposed to on religious grounds? He's still saying one thing and doing another, no change. One minute he talks of living his whole life as a Catholic and the next he touts appointing open minded justices as if being open minded would mean any moral considerations by the court are somehow unethical.

[TheRealVille]

HRV knows that him and i butted heads. You may post the entire PM if you'd like.

I've now had a complete change of heart in regards to things dealing with gay marriage, where him and I butted heads. I've also seen that you are an habitual 'mistake' maker, and learned that you're completely unable to think rationally. This has led me to reevaluate my stance in regards to how I feel about others.

Quit alluding to something that HRV already knows.

Ok.

Hello there!

I just wanted to say a few things. I've read some of your posts on here, and I appreciate the comments you made about the gay marriage idea. I will warn you, I'm a radical conservative on many issues, and we'll disagree entirely on most things... BUT you will not ever get the name calling or topic switches that others like to pull, from me. I encourage you, to keep fighting for the causes, parties, and ideas that you believe in. Always back up your beliefs with facts when possible, and always keep an open mind to the views of others. More than once, I've made radical changes in my beliefs on a certain issue... usually after deep soul searching, fact checking, and especially after hearing from others.

It sucks that I will end up agreeing more with Harry Rex Vonner and many others than with you. Because I truly hate being in the same company with them. I assure you though, I will keep civil when you and I disagree, and will always be open to the ideas you present. You may have the power to sway someone with what you say.... so keep fighting!

I look forward to the upcoming election, and our thoughtful debate!

[ronald reagan]

Ok.

:thatsfunn

Oh the incriminating pm that contains such damning secret information :hilarious:

That was from I think my second or third day here. I realized recently the error of my ways in regards to gay marriage. I asked for forgiveness to those I offended with my arrogance, and ignorance. HRV was one of those to be included in that apology. I'm sure HRV will lose sleep over the above pm. hahahaha

But thanks, now we can get past it. And, did your ignore button malfunction, or did you just continue your unbroken streak of lies? You notice the difference between you and I? I never run from who I am at the core, or a fight worth fighting. I'm willing to admit error, correct my thinking, and at the very least, research my own thoughts on a particular subject to find where I'm right, why I'm wrong, or how can I improve upon it. You on the other hand are a constant mess of confusion who resorts to everything but fact to prove his view. Its so bad that you spend much of your energy and effort arguing with yourself it seems. I have never seen a weaker view on abortion in my entire life. I really mean that. It goes on and on, caveats here, cavaets there... its legal, i support it... i oppose it personally, but something about viability, trust the medical opinion... i dunno what you'll say next. But I can promise you it probably won't answer the simple questions posed to you.

-Since viability is your cornerstone to the argument, would you then support no abortions past 20 weeks?
-Since legality is your cornerstone at other times, will you oppose abortion if its repealed?
-Do you support partial birth abortion? Child access to abortion services without parental consent? Would you congratulate your wife for aborting your firstborn without telling you, because you believe she should have that right?
-When shown the things that the GOP has done for abortion restriction, that you deny happened i'm assuming, or just refuse to acknowledge... do you cringe? You did say that you switched support after realizing that the GOP had did nothing to help outlaw abortions. Now that you know otherwise, do you want to reconsider?
-When you see pictures of babies in the womb, or perhaps watch a graphic video of an abortion being performed and the baby thrown into the garbage...... do you actually think, "i'm so glad I support allowing women to do this!". If so... the most simple question you will ever get to answer follows:

How on earth, do you sleep at night?