[Van Hagar]

Now that South's great core group is graduating, what does next year look like? I don't want to rank them, I'll just group them the way I see it.

Favorites--Knox Central and North Laurel. KC had no seniors on a solid team, there weakness seems to be a lack of top pitching after Seth Hill. North did graduate four, but have basically six starters back, and no other region team will have a group of three pitchers as strong as Messer, Griebel and Capobianco, a key to regional tournament play.

Contenders--Harlan Co., especially with Sizemore on the mound, will be dangerous. Clay Co., always well-coached, will also be in the mix. Both teams lose some key players, but return enough to be in the conversation. Corbin and Whitley also belong in this group, the Redhounds seemed to get better as the season went on, and Whitley had a nice year, but they have to learn how to win that district elimination game.

Question marks--Obviously South will dip, but they do return Miller, and that could be enough to make them dangerous in a one-game situation. Harlan Ind. made the final four, but I lean towards that being more a factor of a fairly weak district and a favorable regional draw.

Really don't see how any other teams could get in the mix, Middlesboro and Barbourville may be fair, but shouldn't contend.

[HCS]

I think that's pretty accurate.
North will be solid, but they did lose a couple of very good pitchers. They would still probably be my early pick after what I saw in the regional.
Knox will have a veteran team back and no excuses about experience, but they lacked consistency last year.
I think Clay definitely should be in the top five with what they have coming back, plus it's pretty clear by now they are well coached and always seem to be competitive.
South loses more than anyone but still has enough to be dangerous, especially with Miller.
Harlan County has one of the best 1-2 pitching combinations with Sizemore and Burkhart, both lefties, and a good catcher in Rutherford. They will have to develop some depth.
Corbin is always competitive and could win the 50th with South losing so much. As you said, Whitley can't seem to get over the hump.

As for the 52nd District, HCHS is probably the favorite with its pitching, but Middlesboro has a great player in McCullough, who could beat anyone in the district.
Harlan lost two of its best hitters in Abraham and Patrick, but Hogue will be a senior and several other young guys showed improvement late in the season.
Bell loses 8 of 9 starters and will have to start over.

[HCS]

A friend of mine just pointed out something Van Hagar said about the 52nd being a fairly weak district.

In a sense, there is some truth to that since none of the teams were probably in the top three or four at the end.

But, on the flip side, I think it was pretty clear that the 52nd had four of the top 10 teams in the region. All four of the teams in the 52nd were better than all of the teams in the 51st, except KC, all in the 49th, except North and Clay. Harlan split with Whitley during the regular season and HCHS beat Corbin twice, so I think the 52nd and 50th were close, after South, of course.

[RunItUpTheGut]

If Whitley cant figure out how to win a district tourney game ill never bet on that pick.
It was an ugly loss to Corbin in that first round this year.

[Van Hagar]

A friend of mine just pointed out something Van Hagar said about the 52nd being a fairly weak district.

In a sense, there is some truth to that since none of the teams were probably in the top three or four at the end.

But, on the flip side, I think it was pretty clear that the 52nd had four of the top 10 teams in the region. All four of the teams in the 52nd were better than all of the teams in the 51st, except KC, all in the 49th, except North and Clay. Harlan split with Whitley during the regular season and HCHS beat Corbin twice, so I think the 52nd and 50th were close, after South, of course.

That's a fair assessment, a better choice of words from me would have been a fairly balanced district, because all four of the teams this past year could compete, something the other districts didn't have. Afraid Bell will fall completely off the map next year though, because it looked like the vast majority of their team was seniors.

[Hitters_Count]

Thought the big Mills kid did very well. I believe Hill finished the season 7-2, Mills 6-3. Hopefully the new coach will pitch the Nelson kid and utilize his available pitchers this season. Both Hill and Mills should have won a couple more games where they left with a lead and got a ND or loss. Hill, Mills, Nelson, Imel, Lay and Sanborn should be a good stable of pitchers. Key as always is scoring runs, which they did as the year progressed. The loss to NL in the region was an example of running into a hot team and that just outplayed KC. They should by all right won the region, but they ran into a hotter team in SL. With a new Head Coach, who knows what will happen, State or Bust?

[BigFuture]

Clay will be right at the top has always with a few new additions that will make an impact immediately!

[baseball1974]

Clay will be right at the top has always with a few new additions that will make an impact immediately!

Additions? Are they getting transfers of some kind?

Clay has been an underachieving team for the past several years. I understand the two Laurel County teams have been loaded and they had Clay's number, but they could have won that region last year. The biggest difference is the scheduling. South has finally started to do more when it comes to playing tougher competition, and it has helped them gain an advantage over everybody in that region. Clay County just isn't prepared by the time post season comes around. When you have a talented group like Clay and they are barely scraping by teams like Pulaski in May, then that should be a major red flag. They have the talent to win it this year, but they can't go into the region tournament this season with the same kind of preparation.

[BigFuture]

Underachieving? We will see! Spring will be here before we know it! Go Tigers!!!

[ky playmaker]

clay final 5 games before district starts. rockcastle, hazard, barbourville, leslie and middelsboro.

south laurel final 5 games before district starts. madison central,dupont manual,somerset, southwestern,and george rogers clark.

[ky playmaker]

1974 is dead on

[baseball1974]

clay final 5 games before district starts. rockcastle, hazard, barbourville, leslie and middelsboro.

south laurel final 5 games before district starts. madison central,dupont manual,somerset, southwestern,and george rogers clark.

If you are the head coach of a team that is a contender, it becomes your responsibility to schedule teams during the regular season that will prepare them for the post season. You can't accomplish that by playing 95% eastern KY teams. It's just not possible.

[Big Red Machine]

South Laurel could have won the regional title last year if they would have sit out the final week of the season. They were the best team, and should have one. Clay played them as close as anyone pitching 2 sophomore pitchers.

IMO, Clay has overachieved the last few years. People tend to forget Clay won the regional title in back to back years not that long ago. Up til then Clay had only won 1 regional title in school history. Clay has never been considered a threat in baseball until Coach Smith took over. With a few new additions, and a very good junior class I believe Clay will compete for a regional title for the next couple years.

[BigFuture]

Agree!

[RicFlair]

How is middlesboro not included anytime you're talking about the 13th region....9/10 years they're there and competitive

[baseball1974]

South Laurel could have won the regional title last year if they would have sit out the final week of the season. They were the best team, and should have one. Clay played them as close as anyone pitching 2 sophomore pitchers.

IMO, Clay has overachieved the last few years. People tend to forget Clay won the regional title in back to back years not that long ago. Up til then Clay had only won 1 regional title in school history. Clay has never been considered a threat in baseball until Coach Smith took over. With a few new additions, and a very good junior class I believe Clay will compete for a regional title for the next couple years.

South Laurel did win the region last year.
I agree Clay is a contender, but until they change-up their schedule they are just going to keep spinning their wheels, and will not get any better. When you have to play teams like Oneida Baptist and Red Bird, then you have to make an effort to balance that out with some teams that are ranked in the state. If you don't play anyone better than you then you won't get any better. Their schedule this upcoming year may be worse than last year. When your team is the best team on your schedule, then your priority looks to be more of trying to rack up wins rather than advancing at the end of the year. Clay should be doing more with the talent they have. Winning 30 games is pointless if you can't even win your district. It shows up when you see they are barely beating teams like Pulaski and Madison Southern at the end of the year. They should be getting better as the season goes on and that doesn't seem to be happening.

[walterwhite]

Smith has done a good job of making Clay relevant, but I agree on the schedule. In order to reach your full potential you have to be tested throughout the season.

[baseball1974]

Smith has done a good job of making Clay relevant, but I agree on the schedule. In order to reach your full potential you have to be tested throughout the season.

Smith has done an excellent job at keeping them consistently solid. The two seasons before he took over they were 21-4 and 26-7. So its not like he took over a bad team. If you want to consistently gain ground as a program you have to make sure of two things when it comes to scheduling. You must always play your 36-game limit no matter what. A lot of people will argue that you can't do anything about rain-outs, but that's not true. It's not just your team being rained-out. So you can always reschedule those games and find teams to add to your schedule. If you want to just take care of it before the season then you schedule more games so you can prepare for rain-outs. Regardless, my point is there is no excuse for not playing your maximum allowed games. The other thing that is a must is to always schedule atleast 10 games against teams that are a step-above you. The reason I put it that way is because a coach from Oneida Baptist that wants to build his program shouldn't be scheduling Saint Xavier. It's important to know what level your program is competing at so you can know which teams you need schedule. If you consistently neglect to add teams that are a notch above you, then it sends a message to your administration and players that one of two things is happening. Either you don't think enough of your team or yourself to be confident enough to play those teams, or you are simply trying to get your own "win totals" to a certain level each year in order to maintain job security or ego or whatever. Coach Smith has done a good job, but he needs to make a decision on what type of program he's going to have. When you look at the schedule year-after-year, you start to wonder if maybe he's content on winning 20 games a year and anything after that is just a bonus. I don't know him so I won't make a judgement about him, but I do think that type of thinking and environment for a program is a disservice to those players who I am sure would love to have a shot at making a run in the state tournament. Who knows the reasoning behind the schedule? There could be some type of variables involved that nobody knows. I hope that is the case.

[baseball1974]

How is middlesboro not included anytime you're talking about the 13th region....9/10 years they're there and competitive

Middlesboro was definitely relevant 3 years ago. However, ever since they were the 13th region runner-up under Coach Powell, they have been on downward spiral. Up until this past season, their record was always descent, but when it got around to playing teams that were at the top tier of the 13th, they seemed to get blown out every time. That may be why the schedule has gotten worse and worse. It's gotten to where last year they were barely a .500 team. They have a long way to go to get back in the discussion of being a relevant team in the 13th. They have enough talent to do it, but they just need to find the right fit as their coach and go from there. For whatever reason, the guy that replaced Bill Powell hasn't been a great fit, and a change needs to happen fairly quickly before it becomes an entire "rebuilding project" for someone that will end up taking 3-4 years to get back on track. I do think they have the talent and support to become a great program again.

[walterwhite]

Clay had not played a great schedule well before Smith took over. In fact, believe it or not, his schedules have been an upgrade. I agree that in order to reach your potential you must schedule to your teams ability and above. You can't play a lot of podunks and expect to improve very much.

[sling blade]

Coach Smith has done an excellent job at Clay County.Come on 1974 it wouldn't have mattered if clay had played the Yankees,reds pirates or cubs they wasn't beating south.I do agree that playing tough competition makes you better but clay has been prepared and ready for post season each year smith has coached.Everyone knocked Williamsburg last year in basketball how did that turn out.My point leave Coach Smith alone the only agenda he has is to win the region every year.

[baseball1974]

Coach Smith has done an excellent job at Clay County.Come on 1974 it wouldn't have mattered if clay had played the Yankees,reds pirates or cubs they wasn't beating south.I do agree that playing tough competition makes you better but clay has been prepared and ready for post season each year smith has coached.Everyone knocked Williamsburg last year in basketball how did that turn out.My point leave Coach Smith alone the only agenda he has is to win the region every year.

I said many times he's done a good job, and if that is truly his agenda then he needs to do more about the competition they play. Otherwise, they will stay at the same level they are at now, and the only chances they'll have at winning region is when the rest of the 13th is down talent-wise, which is what happened when they won before. The Williamsburg example is irrelevant due to it being a completely different situation. Their talent level was way above everyone else and that carried them. Clay is not that way. They have average to above average talent, and in the 13th that's really all you need if you do things correctly. I also think they could've had a shot at beating South and North last year. South showed how vulnerable they were in the state tournament. Part of the reason you have to put better teams on your schedule is due to the caliber of pitching you see against those teams. If you spend the entire season with your players hitting against 70 MPH fastballs right down the middle, then it's going to be pretty tough for them when they get to the post season and realize they haven't seen anyone all year that talented. If you add 10 or so games on your schedule with teams that will throw kids with high velocity and location-minded pitchers, then it's not so overwhelming when they see it in the post season. Baseball is different from any other sport in that way.

[Baseballfreak999]

Guys clay county had 3 seniors, 1 junior, 4 sophomores and 1 freshman in their lineup last year. Their top pitchers was sophomores. How can u say that they underachieved. South had a team full of seniors and north was full of juniors and seniors. South and north didn't beat clay because of smiths schedule, they won because they both where very good baseball teams. Look how many guys they had sign to play college ball. It's not like north and south was chump teams. If the schedule is why clay got beat by south what's norths excuse for losing to south? It's not the schedule, South just played better that night. It's baseball.
And to say clay only won the region because the region was week that year is a joke. North was loaded that year. Knox had one of the best pitchers in king. Stop knocking clay on everything and just give them a little credit. They don't claim to be the best every year but u can never count them out. Smith does a great job and with the exception of about 3-4 games a year they play the same teams north and south play.

[ky playmaker]

you have not looked at their schedules evidently. south started year with GRC, scott co, somerset, mercer, north oldham, pulaski, southwestern, then 6 games at espn wide world of sports 5 of the 6 was very good teams.. clay played bell co, middlesboro, bell co, knox, rockcastle, corbin, mcCreary, williamsburg whitley mccreary, perry central, jackson co not even close to same schedule

[Big Red Machine]

I am going to let you in on a little secret. The best team in the 13th region has won it for the past several years. The schedule your team plays really doesn't matter in the 13th region. You are always going to have your 3 or 4 teams that are going to be there no matter what. As far as scheduling goes how has that worked out in the state tournament. Other than South a few years ago, no 13th region team has even scored a run in the state tournament. Winning the 13th region is like winning a state tournament because no team has a chance against those other power house teams. Unless you somehow get lucky and have 2 or 3 pitchers that throw 90+ your not going to go very far in state.
South playing all those good teams didn't win them the region. They were the best team and should have won. How did that hard schedule help them first round of the state?

[RicFlair]

Middlesboro was definitely relevant 3 years ago. However, ever since they were the 13th region runner-up under Coach Powell, they have been on downward spiral. Up until this past season, their record was always descent, but when it got around to playing teams that were at the top tier of the 13th, they seemed to get blown out every time. That may be why the schedule has gotten worse and worse. It's gotten to where last year they were barely a .500 team. They have a long way to go to get back in the discussion of being a relevant team in the 13th. They have enough talent to do it, but they just need to find the right fit as their coach and go from there. For whatever reason, the guy that replaced Bill Powell hasn't been a great fit, and a change needs to happen fairly quickly before it becomes an entire "rebuilding project" for someone that will end up taking 3-4 years to get back on track. I do think they have the talent and support to become a great program again.

Agreed, Bill Powell's last year was a great run but also loads of talent there, coach smith is a great coach and him and his assistants are all coach Powell products. The problem I see isn't at the high school level but at the feeder programs

[HDE]

I agree about the middle school being down, but if you noticed in the football threads the Middlesboro fans insist that has nothing to do with high school success.

[kcfan#1]

Knox has the chance to do great things this coming season.. Wish hillard was still there did great things not just for the team but, also for the community and school system. No more excuses for the panthers its put up or shut up

[Big Red Machine]

I agree kcfan, Knox has a talented group of players this year. They are a senior dominated team that has a chance to make a run for a regional title this year. It will be interesting to see how they do with their new coach.

[walterwhite]

I guess you can tell a lot about the perception a coach has of his program by the schedule he plays. There are those who apparantly think the best they can do is compete within the region, maybe with an outside shot of winning it. Others that are always in the mix and have a shot of capturing the crown year in and year out. Then you have a few that think they can compete at the state level and schedule accordingly. Obviously you have several that have no shot. No shame in any of it. You do what you think is best for your program.