[zaga_fan]

Only time I've ever agreed with this guy.

I would prefer a 1 class system myself lol
I know that I'm probably alone on that one but basketball has spoiled me.

[Gitback Coach]

I agree with the basic premise:

Boot out the private schools and go to four classes. Problem solved.

[BellCoBobcats09]

I understand that thinking totally. Although I'll point out what I pointed out to a bunch of folks from Fort Thomas that were complaining to me about the state finals being moved from Louisville to BG because they'd have to drive an additional hour and a half: it's one game a year and that's only if you are fortunate enough to even get that far. Part of me thinks the problem with some Bell Co. folks is not the fact that the game is so far, it's more a matter of who they have to play (Central).

Not the reason. Imagine driving to Louisville for Region Title, then maybe a Paducah Til for State Semi, then back to Bowling Green if we made it to the State Championship game when its our time to travel in playoff time.

To:
Louisville 205 miles and 3hrs 27min for a Regional Championship game.
Paducah 355 miles and 5hrs 51min for a State Semi game.
Bowling Green 200 miles and 3hrs 33min for a State Championship game.

Going to Paducah from Middlesboro is like going a hour south of Atlanta, GA from here. CRAZY!!!!

[charlie22]

Not the reason. Imagine driving to Louisville for Region Title, then maybe a Paducah Til for State Semi, then back to Bowling Green if we made it to the State Championship game when its our time to travel in playoff time.

To:
Louisville 205 miles and 3hrs 27min for a Regional Championship game.
Paducah 355 miles and 5hrs 51min for a State Semi game.
Bowling Green 200 miles and 3hrs 33min for a State Championship game.

Going to Paducah from Middlesboro is like going a hour south of Atlanta, GA from here. CRAZY!!!!

Fair point. Bell is in district 4 and region 2 if I recall properly. Which would mean that in even numbered years, they'd stay at home (assuming even seeded teams) for both games, and in odd numbered years, they'd have to travel for both games.

As for the state game, regardless of where it is and regardless of the number of classes, some schools are always going to have to drive a long way to make it to the state games given the state geography. Personally, I'd like to see the games at EKU, but I doubt the folks in far western Kentucky would agree with that choice.

[BellCoBobcats09]

Fair point. Bell is in district 4 and region 2 if I recall properly. Which would mean that in even numbered years, they'd stay at home (assuming even seeded teams) for both games, and in odd numbered years, they'd have to travel for both games.

As for the state game, regardless of where it is and regardless of the number of classes, some schools are always going to have to drive a long way to make it to the state games given the state geography. Personally, I'd like to see the games at EKU, but I doubt the folks in far western Kentucky would agree with that choice.

Bowling Green is fine. Im just saying having to travel that far for all 3 games in a row would be horrible. That's if Bell did keep winning and if it was our year to travel in playoffs and if PT also won.

[FBfan4life]

I agree with the basic premise:

Boot out the private schools and go to four classes. Problem solved.

Why get rid of private schools? Cause they win multiple championship? Why not get rid of the system that EVERY school making the playoff? How about winning your district and coming in second in your district are the only one's allowed to make the play-offs and keep only to 4 class.

[Observing]

Why get rid of private schools? Cause they win multiple championship? Why not get rid of the system that EVERY school making the playoff? How about winning your district and coming in second in your district are the only one's allowed to make the play-offs and keep only to 4 class.

MY GUY!!! I don't know why we EVER went beyond district winners
and runnersup in the playoffs. And most of the private schools
are on the smae page as the public schools, there's just a lot
of resentment for Trinity and LExCath because of their perceived
advantages(and yes they probably ARE real). I wonder if most
casual fans have the notion that Highlands is a private school?

And right now every school does NOT make the playoffs, but over 80%
do. What kind of sense does that make? If you're going to go that
far, WHY DON'T we make it an all in proposition for the post season
just like in basketball? [that's rhetorical, I do NOT want that]

[Observing]

So far, the dreaded Paducah to Log Mountain trip (or vice versa) has not materialized and there is not any imminent reason to think it would, given Central's ability to use its license as a "magnet" school to recruit countywide in Jefferson.

Thus far, Bell has made a trip to Louisville, which is not onerous. As much as Bell would like to play in a narrow competitive cluster and get a non-Central route to the title game, as late comers to 3A, they are certainly capable of being competitive in their district regardless of being tagged as east or west.

It really sounds like the Bell County fans are scared Central deprives them of their chance to get to the title game. And they look with envy at Belfry, which somehow occupies their spot in the finals.

Bell will have Central down there this year, assuming there are no upsets along the way. Lets see what happens.

I've got no dog in that fight, not a Bell fan. They're just the most
extreme example of the ABSURDITY of the present setup. And with
home field advantage this year making Central come to the mountains,
it's NOT far-fetched AT ALL to see an eventual Tilghman-Bell matchup.
I'd still probably bet on Central, but it would be no shocker. It's just
insane that a team could have to make a trip like that. An all day bus
trip could make a 3TD difference in a game.

[WideMiddle03]

there should be fewer classes it will create more competition. 4a is like the old 3a and 6a the old 4a but some schools like trinity or highlands have purely dominated their classes since the class expansion. trinity will dominate any class but i think highlands wouldn't have all their titles if bowling green or other teams were in their classes. they're good but just my opinion. i want to see a 3 or 4 class system

[Observing]

Fair point. Bell is in district 4 and region 2 if I recall properly. Which would mean that in even numbered years, they'd stay at home (assuming even seeded teams) for both games, and in odd numbered years, they'd have to travel for both games.

As for the state game, regardless of where it is and regardless of the number of classes, some schools are always going to have to drive a long way to make it to the state games given the state geography. Personally, I'd like to see the games at EKU, but I doubt the folks in far western Kentucky would agree with that choice.

For a berth in the State Final, you'd expect and be willing to go a
little furthe(or as far as necessary). But all things considered,
the KHSAA should try to centralize it as much as possible. And
while Bowling Green evidently wanted it more, and it seems a
more fan friendly, the finals probably should be back in Louisville
as the most centrally located venue able to handle the event.

[30 going on 40]

We need 5 classes. 4 public and 1 private.

Make all of the "beating the dead horse" comments you like but private teams and public team are not on equal footing.

5 classes. 4 public and 1 private.

So you eliminate Trinity, X, CovCath, LexCath, Holy Cross and NewCath?

Outside of Trinity, which of these schools, has demolished their class to the point that you don't see equal footing?

[Observing]

there should be fewer classes it will create more competition. 4a is like the old 3a and 6a the old 4a but some schools like trinity or highlands have purely dominated their classes since the class expansion. trinity will dominate any class but i think highlands wouldn't have all their titles if bowling green or other teams were in their classes. they're good but just my opinion. i want to see a 3 or 4 class system

I don't think that Trinity and Highlands dominance has been a good thing
for state football. But I don't have a good solution. Someone, somewhere
is just going to have to rise to the challenge, and work up to their
level. But when you get right down to it, every year you can pick any class,
name 6 teams, and 5 out of 6 years the champ will come from those
6.

[30 going on 40]

I agree with the basic premise:

Boot out the private schools and go to four classes. Problem solved.

Ha ha ha. That would help who exactly that isn't presently in 6A? Funny how fans from Mayfield, Danville, Boyle Co, Highlands, and Beechwood among other successful teams never complain about privates. It is always the also rans who need someone to blame for their team's inabilty to commit totally to football.

[Westside]

I liked the system of 4 classes and the top 2 teams from each district making the playoffs.

[know1]

Of course it's easier. Then again, there are very few teams that can even begin to argue that it's too easy. At most, only 6. Those 6 that win state. As to every one else, I ask the question: if it's so dang easy, why didn't you win it? It sure wasn't too easy for all the schools other than the 6 that actually won state.

Looking at those 6, which ones could truly say it was easy? Trinity can the last two years and such is likely to be the case this year. But it wasn't too easy for them in 09 as they didn't win it. Highlands? Perhaps, based on the fact that they've won the last 5 in a row. But if we would have had 4 classes during those years, I'm very confident that they'd have still won state in 07, 08, 09 and 10. As for 11, if BG had been in Highlands class and not in the largest classification, a Highlands BG state final would have been one heck of a game and I'm really not sure who would have won that game.

Central? Again perhaps. But they missed a year and they were fortunate to get out of BG last year with a state title. It was a very hard fought game and it sure wasn't easy for them. So it's not exactly been a walk in the park for them every year.

No denying that we do have some early round blowouts. But I've seen early round blowouts for a long time and certainly before we went to 6 classes. For example, when I played back in the 70's, under the 4 class system I might add, when people hardly knew what the forward pass what and low scoring games were the norm, in 1975 we won our first playoff game 49-22 and the second playoff game 36-6. I and the other starters didn't play in the second half of either playoff game and every point scored by our opponents was in the second half against our 2nd and 3rd string. They were blowouts. There were blowouts then and there will be blowouts now.

I ask you to consider the impact that the changing offenses have had on the scores also. The development of the spread offenses with their quick strike and high scoring capabilities may be more of a factor than anything else in the blowout scores we are seeing today. When one team is considerably better and that team passes the ball, they can rack up huge amounts of points quickly. Back in the day when you ran the ball 90 plus percent of the time, it still took a fair amount of time to score even when playing a weaker opponent. A team might be able to drive the ball down their opponents throat, but generally, it takes more plays to score which means more time coming off the clock while in the huddle and during the action. Now, a deep pass for a score takes 15 seconds off the clock. Today's offenses have many, many more possessions to score.

Again, I respect and understand folks unhappiness with the 6 class system. I'd like to see it given some more time before it's abandoned. The every team or almost every team making the playoffs situation doesn't bother me at all however. That is the norm for every other sport that I can think of, so why should football be different? Because back in the day when the critics played, not everyone got in is not a good reason for me. Sorry.

I didn't say "easy", I said "easier". There's a difference.

Boyle Co. won 2 state championships during Highlands' recent run that they wouldn't have otherwise.

[Mayfieldsportsfan]

Couldn't agree more it makes no sense for Bell to have to travel to Louisville or vice versa for a REGIONAL championship game.

If they keep the 6 classes I think they should only take the top 2 teams in each district to the playoffs each season. Teams with 1,2, or 3 win teams have no bussiness making the playoffs.

Two years ago Mayfield had to travel to Louisville for the Regional finals. The next week we had to head to Beechwood. Next came the state finals in Bowling Green. Very hard on the old bill fold!

[Observing]

I realize you don't understand Highlands when you make those statements. Making it easier to win a state championship is simply not the way Highlands thinks. If it was, they'd have stayed in 3A for the first 4 years we went to 6 classes and just dealt with the increased distances. But they didn't do that, now did they? They moved up to 5A. And won it each of the 4 years. Does that sound like a program that wants it to be easy? Sure doesn't to me. But maybe you know more about Highlands than I do after living my entire life in Fort Thomas other than while in the Marines.

As for whether the 6 classes helps or hurts enthusiasm, you may very well be right. I don't think so, but you may be right. The KHSAA may after a couple of years go back to 4A or try 5A. The idea was to give it a try and see how it works out. If the coaches and administrators don't feel it has helped, my guess is the the BOC will change it.

Charlie I think the misunderstanding lies on your side. You said
the Highlands program opposed going to 6 classes. Going to 6
classes makes it easier for Highlands. So I respect that they
wanted to stay in a 4 class system that did NOT make it easier.

[ballboy]

Im in favor of the 4 classes and not 6 for one Teams like Highland,Mayfield,Hazard,Trinity andLexington,Catholic would all not be favorites year in and year out. But on the other hand Bell,Co got the shaft with the 6 classes being in the west and should be in the east and it would make for more competitive district games and playoff games and teams that go 0-10 would not be in the playoffs and get beat 60-0. But their would probably be 8 teams in each district. But 4A would be O.K.

[Observing]

Two years ago Mayfield had to travel to Louisville for the Regional finals. The next week we had to head to Beechwood. Next came the state finals in Bowling Green. Very hard on the old bill fold!

More ammo for my cause. Fewer classes, and fewer playoff
berths per class, cuts down on travel expense. More compact
districts and regions make for less travel in the early rounds,
and eliminating 3 and 4 seeds eliminates ALL travel for one
week.

[Observing]

Im in favor of the 4 classes and not 6 for one Teams like Highland,Mayfield,Hazard,Trinity andLexington,Catholic would all not be favorites year in and year out. But on the other hand Bell,Co got the shaft with the 6 classes being in the west and should be in the east and it would make for more competitive district games and playoff games and teams that go 0-10 would not be in the playoffs and get beat 60-0. But their would probably be 8 teams in each district. But 4A would be O.K.

We had 4 class football for years, there weren't any 8 team districts.
And winner/runnerup only makes sure no winless teams make the playoffs.

[charlie22]

Charlie I think the misunderstanding lies on your side. You said
the Highlands program opposed going to 6 classes. Going to 6
classes makes it easier for Highlands. So I respect that they
wanted to stay in a 4 class system that did NOT make it easier.

Help me out; what have I misunderstood? Highlands would rather there be 4 classes. If 4 classes makes it tougher to win state, Highlands is fine with it being tougher. The point that they requested a move up from 3A and played in 5A for the first 4 years we had 6 classes and won state each of those 4 years is solid evidence that Highlands isn't interested in the easy route.

And for those casual fans out there that might think otherwise, Highlands is a public school.

[charlie22]

I didn't say "easy", I said "easier". There's a difference.

Boyle Co. won 2 state championships during Highlands' recent run that they wouldn't have otherwise.

Are you saying that Boyle wouldn't have won those two championships if Highlands had been in the same class, or Highlands wouldn't have won those two championships if Boyle had been in the same class?

I agree it's easier. Said so in my opening sentence. Even with it easier, a whole lot of teams still aren't getting it done. My guess is that if you talked to a lot of coaches, they may say it's easier, but it sure is dang tough to do.

[Observing]

Help me out; what have I misunderstood? Highlands would rather there be 4 classes. If 4 classes makes it tougher to win state, Highlands is fine with it being tougher. The point that they requested a move up from 3A and played in 5A for the first 4 years we had 6 classes and won state each of those 4 years is solid evidence that Highlands isn't interested in the easy route.

And for those casual fans out there that might think otherwise, Highlands is a public school.

What you don't seem to be getting is that I said it was admirable
for the Highlands program to NOT want 6 classes. That indicates
they DON'T want to water down the competition or titles. Your
original post said it was the logical choice for Highlands, not the
emtional one, for going to 6 classes. The only logic to that
sentiment would be that it became easier to win a title.

[Bloody Harlan]

Why get rid of private schools? Cause they win multiple championship? Why not get rid of the system that EVERY school making the playoff? How about winning your district and coming in second in your district are the only one's allowed to make the play-offs and keep only to 4 class.

That's what I've always said.

[MustangSally]

I agree with the basic premise:

Boot out the private schools and go to four classes. Problem solved.

Why? don't you want to be the best high school football team in the state?

[MustangSally]

I guess im in the minority, but i like that six class system.
I honestly believe it makes and equal playing field.

I would never want to see it go back to the old 4 class system. Who honestly thinks Letcher Central or any other school who would be 4A from the mountains, actually beat Trinity, ever?

5 Classes may work. I dont buy this bull crap nonsense that putting the private schools in there own division would hurt, because quite frankly i dont care about the private schools, but the khsaa will always cater to them.

With 5 classes, i would put ALLprivate schools in 5A, no matter enrollment. Then i would take the rest of the teams you see in 6A, along with the biggest schools from 5A and merge it all into one. Then the classes could be 1A(1-450) 2A (451-800) 3A (801-1100) 4A (1101-1500) 5A (Private schools, 1501-unlimited.)

So this would be you're 5A?
Bethlehem
Bishop Brossart
Christian Academy-Louisville
Covington Catholic
DeSales
Holy Cross (Covington)
Holy Cross (Louisville)
Kentucky Country Day
Lexington Catholic
Lexington Christian
Newport Central Catholic
Owensboro Catholic
St. Xavier
Trinity (Louisville)

That Bethlehem vs. Trinity sure would be a great 1st round playoff game:Cheerlead

[footballfever]

We had 4 class football for years, there weren't any 8 team districts.
And winner/runnerup only makes sure no winless teams make the playoffs.

There were 8 team districts in old 4 class system.
Football is a very demanding sport. Kids, coaches, parents are ask to be involved year round. If we go to 4 classes, 3 classes 1 team, 2 teams in playoffs, less teams have chance for success. Now there are many teams who open the season thinking they have a chance to win a district, make to region, semi or final. Whats wrong with that.

[MustangSally]

I don't get it about separating the private schools. Doesn't it cheapen the whole thing if you don't play all the best teams in the state?

[charlie22]

What you don't seem to be getting is that I said it was admirable
for the Highlands program to NOT want 6 classes. That indicates
they DON'T want to water down the competition or titles. Your
original post said it was the logical choice for Highlands, not the
emtional one, for going to 6 classes. The only logic to that
sentiment would be that it became easier to win a title.

OK...sort of. You are certainly correct: I didn't understand that your posts were saying Highlands opposition to 6 classes was admirable; I interpreted them as you stating that you did not believe me when I said Highlands was opposed to 6 classes.

My original post said my vote on the 6 classes as a Board of Control member was based on logic; not emotion. It did not say Highlands choice was based on logic, or emotion for that matter. All it said was the Highlands coach was not in favor of 6 classes. Paintsville Tiger had made a comment about emotional arguments being made. I was responding that my argument, decision and vote in favor of 6 classes was not based on emotion.

One other point: did you notice the part of my post that said there were blowouts even when we had 4 classes? It undermines the contention that if we got rid of 6 classes and went back to 4 classes we wouldn't have blowouts in the playoffs. We would. Maybe a few less, but there would still be blowouts. Furthermore did you also happen to notice that when we had 4 classes when I played, there were only 2 playoff games and then the state game? You only had to win 2 games and you were at State. Some would say that made it pretty easy to make it to state (and to be honest, it was for my team as we easy beat Knox Central and Cawood). Under the system as it is, there are an additional 2 playoff games played before making it to state. Those are additional opportunities for kids to practice and play the game they love; additional opportunities for kids and programs to get better. It was the position of the head coaches that just one more week of being able to practice and play would be good for their programs even if it meant getting blown out in the first playoff game. They felt their players and programs would benefit more than they would suffer. I deferred to their thinking believing they would know better than me on that issue.

[30 going on 40]

I don't get it about separating the private schools. Doesn't it cheapen the whole thing if you don't play all the best teams in the state?

No, Silly. It only makes it easier to win the title. There are a handful of publics (many of whom don't compete directly with privates for students anyway. Some of them don't even have privates in their own class) who don't care how watered down the competition is as long as they get a trophy. See, that's how you save time and effort. You don't work year round for a trophy, you slowly try to politically eliminate those that do.