[Mr.Kimball]

LOL OK Kimball, to make this crystal clear for you once and for all. I do not partake anymore. I do however still believe that Medical Marijuanna and Industrial Hemp are exremely effective tools to fight disease as well as poverty.

I hope you understood all of that without the Colorful Pop-Up Pictures. :biggrin:

Hmmmm, perhaps that's not the only thing that you partook of. Those pop up pictures that keep running through your mind are what's known as "flashbacks.":biggrin:

[outdoorsman43]

I can survive without Coal or Electricity. I can not survive without clean drinking water.

I think you need to re-examine your priorities. You're obviously part of the Wal-Mart Nation.

Just gimme a cave and a creek and I'll make a living!

If you want to live without coal and electricity, then go right ahead and find your cave and creek to live in. In fact, all environmentalist's should do this. Unless of course, you want to be a hypocrite.

[Old School]

I love mountains too. The reclaimed mountains that are mined are just as beautiful as before. It's not like trees and vegetation isn't replanted and regrown.

You obviously don't understand what all this action affects. 50% of thereabout of America's energy is powered by coal. This affects deep mining also, not just mountain top mining. Without EPA permits, deep mining sites can't dump their slurry (waste products from the preparation plant) in slurry ponds. Since EPA is not letting anyone sign permits as or right now, this stops deep mining as well. If mountain top mining and deep mining are haulted, then how much percent of America's energy will be instantly taken away?

This action was obviously not thought through.

Good Post!!:Thumbs:

You brought up several good points, a majority of the people think that this will only effect MTR, but like you said, it will effect every aspect of mining, including all forms of surface mining and underground mining as well.

[Old School]

First thing

i have nothing at all against regular mineing
second of all. if we just let enviromental standards slide
we will have more **** in our water than we do now. and if would profit in front of enviroment it'll be our demise because

What do you consider regular mining?

[Old School]

What gives you the power to get people clean water? I didn't know Jet Pilots did that sort of thing.

I don't know their addresses or phone numbers. I only met them 1 time on 2 different occasions. 2 people- 2 occasions.

Michael Moore type video huh? You're hoping that invoking his name will discredit the facts.

I'm sorry JP but we'll never see eye to eye on this one.

http://www.ilovemountains.org/resources

DW......Did you just have a Biden moment? :thatsfunn

[that guy]

So, DevilsWin, are willing to put +100,000 (I dont know the exact number, I would think more than that though. I may be wrong.) people out of jobs just so you dont have to go and pay for your clean drinking water? Get your MORALS straight. Just go live in the cave you mentioned, as well as your enviromentalist friends.

[phs1986]

Children need food, clothing, water, school necessities,.... OH wait... All of us adults need that stuff too with the exception of the school items...... Putting these men and women out of work will do nothing but cause more of a depression in our area than we are already about to experience. I will not get into the debate about the positives/negatives of MTR but I will say that those who are condeming it.... "Ye shall support those that you are wishing out of work! Send the kids money for school everyday, buy them some nice clothing to wear to school, and OH.. yeah, they need to eat so pick them up some groceries while your on your way home from work at your desk job...... I forgot.... Little Sally needs some new shoes too so could you pick those up while your at it?"

[outdoorsman43]

What do you consider regular mining?

Good question.

I bet Obama also said "I have no problem with regular mining" when he let this act happen.

[DevilsWin]

DW......Did you just have a Biden moment? :thatsfunn

OK I met 2 people from the Doc. 1 on one occasion and the other a few years later. Got it?:yawn:

[DevilsWin]

So, DevilsWin, are willing to put +100,000 (I dont know the exact number, I would think more than that though. I may be wrong.) people out of jobs just so you dont have to go and pay for your clean drinking water? Get your MORALS straight. Just go live in the cave you mentioned, as well as your enviromentalist friends.

Yea, pretty much. :biggrin:

I'll do what I gotta do.

[DevilsWin]

Children need food, clothing, water, school necessities,.... OH wait... All of us adults need that stuff too with the exception of the school items...... Putting these men and women out of work will do nothing but cause more of a depression in our area than we are already about to experience. I will not get into the debate about the positives/negatives of MTR but I will say that those who are condeming it.... "Ye shall support those that you are wishing out of work! Send the kids money for school everyday, buy them some nice clothing to wear to school, and OH.. yeah, they need to eat so pick them up some groceries while your on your way home from work at your desk job...... I forgot.... Little Sally needs some new shoes too so could you pick those up while your at it?"

Get a job at Wal-mart I guess.

[outdoorsman43]

Yea, pretty much. :biggrin:

I'll do what I gotta do.

Nice, mature way to think about it.

[phs1986]

Get a job at Wal-mart I guess.

You guess? Honey, Wal-mart will close as well as there will be no one who has money to shop. BUT, here is you a tid-bit of "updated" news.... The EPA did NOT block all permits... ONLY 2 permits... the the legislature is working on that problem also... here is you a link!!!

http://www.wkyt.com/wymtnews/headlines/41854892.html

[Kentucky_Liberal]

Okay guys sorry i don't want to rape and pillage the environment like you obviously don't care about at all. I think regular mining is underground mining not going and blowing the tops off mountains. don't you see the slightest thing wrong with that? Obama could've vetoed but it would've got passed anyway

[DevilsWin]

You guess? Honey, Wal-mart will close as well as there will be no one who has money to shop. BUT, here is you a tid-bit of "updated" news.... The EPA did NOT block all permits... ONLY 2 permits... the the legislature is working on that problem also... here is you a link!!!

http://www.wkyt.com/wymtnews/headlines/41854892.html

So there won't be 100,000 plus people out of work then. :yikes: :Clap:

[jetpilot]

I guess this means the "death water" epidemic rages on.:lmao:

[Coach_Owens87]

I love mountains too. The reclaimed mountains that are mined are just as beautiful as before. It's not like trees and vegetation isn't replanted and regrown.

You obviously don't understand what all this action affects. 50% of thereabout of America's energy is powered by coal. This affects deep mining also, not just mountain top mining. Without EPA permits, deep mining sites can't dump their slurry (waste products from the preparation plant) in slurry ponds. Since EPA is not letting anyone sign permits as or right now, this stops deep mining as well. If mountain top mining and deep mining are haulted, then how much percent of America's energy will be instantly taken away?

This action was obviously not thought through.

lol, what a joke. If anyone honestly thinks that reclaimed mountains are anywhere near the quality of the mountian before mining, you are either brainwashed, or ignorant.

Take a biology course, or more specifically an ecology or conservation course, or just do some studying and read about edge effects, erosion, run off, etc. Reclaimed mountians are not "reclaimed" at all.

I dont think MTR can or should be stopped at this exact moment, but we should be doing everything in our power to reduce the number of MTR mines in the very near furture. The effects of MTR have been ignored for too long, hoepfully that will change and we can start the process of getting away from coal and MTR before it is too late.

[Coach_Owens87]

So, DevilsWin, are willing to put +100,000 (I dont know the exact number, I would think more than that though. I may be wrong.) people out of jobs just so you dont have to go and pay for your clean drinking water? Get your MORALS straight. Just go live in the cave you mentioned, as well as your enviromentalist friends.

Can you coal guys come up with anything else to defend yourself besides the scare tactic putting people out of jobs? How about we get away from mining, clean up the environment, and train people for jobs in new industries?

Sooner or later we are going to have to get away from coal, and the sooner the better. It does no good to explain the damages that MTR is doing, because most of you dont care, or arent wise enough to see it, but the damages will become very clear in the near future.

[outdoorsman43]

lol, what a joke. If anyone honestly thinks that reclaimed mountains are anywhere near the quality of the mountian before mining, you are either brainwashed, or ignorant.

Take a biology course, or more specifically an ecology or conservation course, or just do some studying and read about edge effects, erosion, run off, etc. Reclaimed mountians are not "reclaimed" at all.

I dont think MTR can or should be stopped at this exact moment, but we should be doing everything in our power to reduce the number of MTR mines in the very near furture. The effects of MTR have been ignored for too long, hoepfully that will change and we can start the process of getting away from coal and MTR before it is too late.

Well, what about all the good that comes out of these reclaimed mountains?

Stone Crest Golf Course in Prestonsburg is nothing but a mined out strip. It also includes baseball fields, soccer fields, and a horse corral. Super Walmart in Hazard and many other businesses are located on a huge mined out strip.

You, or no one else can possibly tell me nothing good comes out of reclamation.

[Mr.Kimball]

Can you coal guys come up with anything else to defend yourself besides the scare tactic putting people out of jobs? How about we get away from mining, clean up the environment, and train people for jobs in new industries?
Sooner or later we are going to have to get away from coal, and the sooner the better. It does no good to explain the damages that MTR is doing, because most of you dont care, or arent wise enough to see it, but the damages will become very clear in the near future.

Yeah, that would be great, but you name me one industry that has the first bit of interest in coming to eastern Kentucky? There is absolutely nobody that wants to come here or has a very high opinion about anything that we have to offer.

Seeing that you claim to be from Knott Co., just what else do you think is going to put bread on your and everyone else's table there?

You are very wrong however in the statement about reclaimed mining areas. They have made useless tracts of land into very usefull properties in Knott Co. very beautiful and useful. If it were not for the coal industry, I can think of a lot of nice touches that would have never happened in Knott Co. I myself, think that the miles and miles of grasslands are pleasant to look at. You would never have had the elk industry for one thing. There is also a fabulous recreation area at the sportsplex there. Where else could it have been built? What would have financed it? Every single good thing that you have in Knott Co. all comes from what coal has done.

I am not associated with the coal industry at all, but I am smart enough to know that every single thing in eastern Kentucky is dependent on it. When it dies , we all die financially.

Your right one of these days it will be gone regardless of if we want it to be or not, and I agree that there are obstacles to overcome. Not any easy solution to this one.

[Mr.Kimball]

Can you coal guys come up with anything else to defend yourself besides the scare tactic putting people out of jobs? How about we get away from mining, clean up the environment, and train people for jobs in new industries?

Sooner or later we are going to have to get away from coal, and the sooner the better. It does no good to explain the damages that MTR is doing, because most of you dont care, or arent wise enough to see it, but the damages will become very clear in the near future.

If you think those are just scare tactics , you just wait and see if it is not an economic disaster if anything happens to damage the industry. Wake up to reality bud.

[Matman]

Can you coal guys come up with anything else to defend yourself besides the scare tactic putting people out of jobs? How about we get away from mining, clean up the environment, and train people for jobs in new industries?


Sooner or later we are going to have to get away from coal, and the sooner the better. It does no good to explain the damages that MTR is doing, because most of you dont care, or arent wise enough to see it, but the damages will become very clear in the near future.

Thats alot easier to say than to actually do. What industry would you suggest we train people for that is going to be the same pay and benifits. While i'm all for the enviroment and i love nature we have to support our own. Just because I am not a coal miner does not mean I am going to turn my back on them. Thats the industry that put food on many tables in this area and i'm not just going to say the heck with all the men and women that work in it.

[that guy]

HAHAHA, you all are a joke. Coal runs EVERYTHING in Eastern KY. It powers more than 50% of OUR energy (I dont know about he rest of the country, but we have a higher percentage). Hey, if you want to save the enviroment, feel free to shut off your power. How would you like that? Alright, let me break this down as I did on another forum. If the coal goes out, all the coal miners will lose their jobs, the coal truckers will lose their jobs because there wont be any coal to haul, truck service/repair shops will go out of business because there isnt any business, some of the gas stations will close because because their main business is coal truckers, that hurts the oil companies and jacks UP the price on oil; now thats one way. The other way is that we will have to spend a whole lot of money to find an alternate energy source (Doubtful) in Eastern KY, so the electric companies will have gigantic lay-offs and because of the energy source being cut off by atleast 60%, your energy bill will be OUTRAGEOUS, as well as the business, which in turn, causes them to cut back and lay-off workers if not close down. Look at how many jobs are lost, and this stuff is off the top of my head. Do you really want this just to save a little on the enviorment?. If they completely shut down mining, everyone will wish we were in a recession; because the depression will be hard...

Im pretty sure that you are involved in this "scare tactic". :biggrin:

[Old School]

Okay guys sorry i don't want to rape and pillage the environment like you obviously don't care about at all. I think regular mining is underground mining not going and blowing the tops off mountains. don't you see the slightest thing wrong with that? Obama could've vetoed but it would've got passed anyway

As outdoorsman43 said, underground mining also utlizes ponds and valley fills, in fact most slurry ponds and refuse fills are 4 or 5 times larger than valley fills found on surface mining operations. I've noticed you like to use the term blowing the tops off mountains, which indicates to me that you know nothing about MTR and like others are getting your information from environmentalist.

What could have Barry vetoed? What passed anyway?

[Old School]

[youtube="Death Water!"]kQPYKD4WGew[/youtube]

While I've not wasted my time watching this particular documentary, I have watched others and their all the same. I would have to ask the guy pouring a glass of iron water. Was his water clear before surface mining started? Was it tested before mining? How close to the mining operation was he? A while back a local resident filed a complant with the state claiming we damaged their drinking water, the state came out took a sample from his home and had it tested, they then compared the results with the samples taken prior to mining and guess what the recent water sample was better quality than the one taken prior to mining. Another interseting note when I was growing up in the early 60's we had the same iron problem in our water, it was so bad you counldn't use it to wash clothes in and there wasn't a surface mine in the whole County at that time. One last thing, Why do enviro's always show coal fired power plants? How gullible do they think we are, they are trying to say that the apparent smoke coming out of the stack is pollutants, when actually it is steam, just plain old steam.

[DevilsWin]

While I've not wasted my time watching this particular documentary, I have watched others and their all the same. I would have to ask the guy pouring a glass of iron water. Was his water clear before surface mining started? Was it tested before mining? How close to the mining operation was he? A while back a local resident filed a complant with the state claiming we damaged their drinking water, the state came out took a sample from his home and had it tested, they then compared the results with the samples taken prior to mining and guess what the recent water sample was better quality than the one taken prior to mining. Another interseting note when I was growing up in the early 60's we had the same iron problem in our water, it was so bad you counldn't use it to wash clothes in and there wasn't a surface mine in the whole County at that time. One last thing, Why do enviro's always show coal fired power plants? How gullible do they think we are, they are trying to say that the apparent smoke coming out of the stack is pollutants, when actually it is steam, just plain old steam.

Now I've heard it all.:lmao:

Mining improves water quality! LOL

Good one Old School!

[Mr.Kimball]

Now I've heard it all.:lmao:

Mining improves water quality! LOL

Good one Old School!

I'll tell you what DW. Knowing the expertise that Old School has on not only the subject, but the industry as a whole , I'm inclined to listen to what he has to say.

Your expertise and experience is in what? "Growing Dope? ":biggrin:

[DevilsWin]

I'll tell you what DW. Knowing the expertise that Old School has on not only the subject, but the industry as a whole , I'm inclined to listen to what he has to say.

Your expertise and experience is in what? "Growing Dope? ":biggrin:

Yes, I produce a Mr Kimball everyday!:lmao: :Thumbs:

[Mr.Kimball]

Yes, I produce a Mr Kimball everyday!:lmao: :Thumbs:

:lmao:

Amazing comeback. I'll give you credit , where credit is due.

[Old School]

Now I've heard it all.:lmao:

Mining improves water quality! LOL

Good one Old School!

If you hang around long enough you may learn a few things. This incident was investigated by the state, therefore all records pertaining to this investigation are made public. Now if you still doubt my account of this incident may I suggest you FOIA the report.